Academy And Under-23s

Lost 2-0.

Supposedly it was far from a full strength City side for the age group as well.

 

Phew! Does that mean we will get to keep all our young players ?

 

All seen getting into the luggage bay under the Man City bus post-match apparently. I guess they’ll sort the wheat from the chaff at motorway services on the way back.

 

Watched the game tonight. City as expected were a class above. Sharper, quicker. We huffed and puffed. Had a shot on around 75th minute and that’s about it.

I know it was against City, but I don’t really see too many of ours from what was on show tonight really making it if I’m honest.

 

Brief "highlights" on the official youtube channel.

The City players seem so much sharper than ours it's frankly absurd. Though it doesn't help when we gift them goals like we did with their first with a dreadful attempt at a clearance.

 

You may have seen George Abbott has gone on loan to Potters Bar Town until January 28.

He started the first game he was available for and promptly got injured just before half-time, having to be substituted.

 

Ladies, gentlemen & everyone else on the gender spectrum, I give you the Dover Athletic player of the month for December 2023 - Scott Holding. Well done Scott

Dover play in the National League South, the division below the National League

 

The big title race got a bit more interesting this morning as the under 18s beat Colchester 2-0 (a third was disallowed while our keeper saved a United penalty) and Bristol City lost for just the second time, a 1-3 reverse against lowly Bournemouth

This puts Watford just 3 points behind City with us having a better goal difference (as well as being the top scorers in the league)

It's a squad made up of many new faces for this age group as well as a new coach (Tom Cleverley) in their charge. One of the new faces, 16 year old Amin Nabizada, once again got on the scoresheet and for a winger he's been a regular scorer so far

Results and league positions ultimately mean very little but it's nice to see us winning games at this level and hopefully bodes well that one or two individuals are fast tracked into the under 21s next season, maybe even progressing further in 3 or 4 seasons time

 

That's great to hear but I do feel like there Is a lot of players like Scott in our U21s and academy where realistically won't ever play for Watford. I could be wrong and I don't follow the academy all that much. It seems you follow the academy a lot Oxhey and have good knowledge on it so I do want to ask you Do you think we have to much deadwood in our academy?

 

Deadwood is a harsh term, especially for players developing within any academy as no two players will progress at the same rate. An exciting 16 year old right now may crash & burn in 6 months time while, for example, Scott Holding's loan at Dover may be just the thing that propels his development that sees him edging towards the first team next season. The chances are it won't but you just never really know. That's why these loans happen, to gauge where the players are at and to give them every chance to develop further.

The club must feel all the players at the academy warrant the time and effort to try and progress them, as long as the individuals have excellent attitudes and are showing signs of development. They wouldn't be at the club otherwise.

If you start ditching players every 6 months or because they're not knocking on the first team door at 19 then you're not putting a lot of faith in the coaches at the academy, the programmes set out for the players or the players themselves and their ability to develop past the age of 18 or 19.

That's still an incredibly young age really so why not afford them the chance to carry on their footballing education at the club until 20 or 21 and see where they are then.

Looking from the outside in, there are some that seem less likely than others to make it but there are too many factors both on and off the pitch to make a truly informed prediction as to who has the better chance or who has no chance at all.

The easy answer of course is to say yeah, 99% of them are deadwood because players of late simply don't come through, but to me that's lazy thinking and disrespectful to the hours of work put in throughout the academy. Because of the way the club has been run these past 10 years we'll never really know if anyone could have developed playing for the first team because they haven't been given the chance, the owners preferring players already at a supposed level being bought in. And to also argue that there are no recent academy players playing at a high level, well after leaving Watford their chances narrowed because the standard of coaches, facilities, teammates and opposition will have decreased meaning, in all likelihood, their development progression will have been stunted too.

Try not to expect Premiership ready footballers to come through though, just hope that those given the chance, for whatever reason, are equipped with enough talent, intelligence and drive to learn from those chances and are able to kick on from there.

 

I posted the above a few weeks ago in response to a question about George Abbott.

Today the under 21's played against Cardiff, (0-0 if anyone is interested), and it's the first game I've watched for a while where Abbott & Josh Mullins wasn't the centre-back pairing. Instead, Mullins played alongside Aidan Coyne.

The reason I'm posting this is because without Abbott the defence appeared to play a higher line with both Mullins & Coyne showing good speed, particularly when the ball was played behind them but in their general overall play.

So I wonder if having Abbott in the side means the defence needs to play a little deeper due to the lack of pace on his part.

I was particularly taken with how quick Mullins looked as he's tall and solidly built. Even moving forward with the ball at his feet he appeared pretty quick and looks to have gained a little pace on this showing.

In fact, without Abbott next to him I thought Mullins looked a far better player. Generally comfortable on the ball, dominant in the air and happy to carry the ball forward. He only turned 18 in November and is already a decent physical specimen, and on todays showing looks like he's making good progress as a footballing centre-half. And no, he isn't 1st team ready. Who knows, a loan in the second half of this season or early next season may be in the offing.

A word on Aidan Coyne too. I didn't realise he was only 19 and had kind of parked him at the back of my mind as I thought he was close to 21. He came here as a defender, has been used a lot as a deep lying midfielder without being overly convincing and I was beginning to wonder why he was being persisted with.

Today, back in his natural role as a centre back, he looked far more comfortable. Both quick and agile with a sense of urgency about his overall play, something all too often missing both individually and collectively at age level football. His passing was a tad above average at best but he was all too happy to hit a long ball rather than play out, though it was more obvious as to why the club brought him here from Australia 15 months ago than on his midfield showings.

As for the game itself, not a lot happened really. A battle between two very average sides on a hard bobbly pitch which was made even more difficult to play/watch when a strong wind joined in the fun for the second-half.

The takeaways were... um, err, Adu-Poku is still a strong winger who will be a handful if he can find a final ball. Massiah-Edwards takes up excellent positions in the box when the opposite winger is taking on his man. Leo Ramirez-Espain played defensive midfield and it was my first view of him. He looked okay, a bit off the pace and lightweight but as he's not long turned 17 and this was possibly his first start for the under21's, he's certainly not played too many, that is to be expected. Looked easy on the ball with nice composure. He was often left isolated as Charlie Davis and Junior Gyamfi were caught too far forward but he generally held his own. A promising showing if not dynamic.

 

Good summary. It's strange to hear about Abbott, because when he arrived I always thought he was a deep-lying defensive midfielder, and he's even listed as such on sites like transfermarkt. The way you describe him, with a lack of pace, it sounds like DMC would suit him better?

 

I'm pretty sure, without looking up old reports or digging around, that Abbott has always been a centre-back. I may be wrong but that's my memory of him.

As for his pace and my opinion of him after seeing a different pairing yesterday, I may be well off the mark. It was just an impression I got and it will be something to look out for next time I watch him.

I'd just like to add, I don't think he's oil tanker slow but I'm pretty sure he's not speed boat quick either. He's somewhere in-between but will, in my opinion, struggle against speedy opposition. There is usually a lasting impression of players I watch and with Abbott it's how comfortable he appears to be with the ball at his feet. I just can't recall him sprinting back or outpacing anyone. It may well be his positioning is that good he doesn't have to outpace the opposition, I can't really say with any amount of confidence.

He has lots of promise though, I'd just like him to be a bit more physical and nasty to play against.

It's also easy to forget he'll only turn 19 later this month because he seems to have been around for an age.

 

Shaq Forde has scored again, this time against League One leaders Portsmouth

Well taken after a nice first time pass, a good run into space between two defenders and receiving an excellent return ball from Max Sanders

https://x.com/pompey_in/status/1746193700626305483?s=20

 

U23's beat Swansea 2-0 today.

Under-23’s beaten at Watford – JackArmy.net

 

"Saturday, 13 March 2021, 13:36"
The clue was "....enabling Pochettino – son of Paris Saint-Germain boss Mauricio – to open the scoring."

 

It's also the under 21's now, since the beginning of last season

 

"First-half goals from Maurizio Pochettino and Phoenix Patterson"

Also, Phoenix Patterson played this Saturday afternoon for Fleetwood Town away at Cambridge.

Though he could have driven up the A1 from Watford to Cambridge after his first game I suppose.

 

Dawid Hamiga joins Slough Town for a month, ending February 13

The 18 year old started out in the Slough Academy and is from that area apparently, joining Watford via Beaconsfield in January 2023

He's a tricky wide player but maybe a little light weight right now, he's not been a regular starter for the under 21s but is usually in and around their match day squad

Slough play in the National League South

 

The cynical among you may well say these are the next two players to leave Watford for bigger clubs

What I will say is both Cayden Lamothe & Mathis Eboue recently attended England under-15 training camps

Anything other than that is impossible for me to know as I'm not Mystic bloody Meg. I'm not even the Oracle of Oxhey so I'll leave the future telling to others

Cayden is on the left, not sure which one is Mathis
(info via @WatfordFCAcad)

 

These are the next two players to leave Watford for bigger clubs.
Not meaning to be cynical, but they are clearly promising so why on earth wouldn't a prem club just take them away for next to nothing ? Madness not to.
Hopefully you didn't use their real names and posted pictures of your neighbours kids in WFC kit ? .

 

Don’t worry, once my kids get older, I will make them sign lifetime contracts for Watford. We just have to wait it out until then.

 

Ex player Kamil Conteh (was in our academy from 2018-21, signed a pro deal where we loaned him out to Braintree before he was released) has done superbly at Grimsby in L2 this season. Being linked to a £400k move to League 1 (Bristol Rovers the likely destination).

 

We've signed a defender!

Not only that, we've signed a left-back!!

Freddie Buers (18) has joined following a two month trial (no idea what he was accused of doing but he must've been found not guilty for the club to sign him) and has come via Kings Langley. That shows a level of determination if he only uses public transport because it's not the easiest route to Vicarage Road from there.

Previously he was at Southend United, coming through their academy from under 9's to under 16's before injuries meant he was let go - yeah, so he says!

Buers has signed an 18 month deal and interestingly (if you don't get out much) he was previously a forward, though he appears to have failed to mentioned that in his brief interview with the Watford site.

Like Ryan Andrews at right back, we have another full-back who has slid down the formation during his formative years so hopefully should have some idea what to do further up field. Also like Andrews, he says he's quick so he's already got one up on James Morris.

https://www.watfordfc.com/index.php/news/official-buers-joins-academy

 

After missing the chance of going top last week, the under 18's today annihilated Cardiff City 5-0

What makes this even more impressive is before today Cardiff were 3rd, 3 points behind Watford (2nd) with two games in hand, but as we already had a better goal difference todays 10 goal swing in our advantage means it's unlikely Cardiff will be able to score enough to leap above us if they were to win those two games. To be precise, we now have a +22 goal difference, Cardiff +9

Even sweeter today was league leaders Bristol City only managing a 1-1 draw with bottom side Colchester

This means Watford are now just a point behind Bristol but with a +5 better goal difference after playing the same amount of games

 

James Collins, a recently turned 19 year old centre forward has joined Haringey Borough for February

He's tall, has an eye for a goal but looks to be lacking in pace (sounds familiar)

Haringey play in the Isthmian League Premier Division, which is tier seven

No, I can never remember what that means either so here's a handy graphic we can all use in the future

 

I saw the announcement and had no idea what level the Isthmian Premier was, so this is handy: thanks!

 

A new low.
Losing to Hertford would be bad enough but Hettford lost 2-0 to Dungey-in-the Wold in the Sir Bufton Tufton Knock Out Cup last month.

 

That was unfortunate for us as it meant they could really focus on landing this trophy. They win it they can officially join the county. A bit like if Israel win the Euro song contest 3 times.

 

Depressing times.

 

re. the Hertford Town cup tie;

It was an unusual starting XI last night with a few players who don't normally start getting a look in (and a trialist) and a bench full of under 18 regulars

And while we have a young under 21 squad anyway, last night only 1 player aged 20 or over played (Stallard) and he isn't a regular starter as it is

Interesting from Daniels to give some possibly fringe players a go against the more experienced and older players of Hertford

 

Oh, this is the cup we're concentrating on. All makes sense now. Well done to the under 17's



A note on Marats Galajevs, he of the magnificent triangular hair in the largest photograph - he started for Latvia in all three UEFA Under 17 European Championship qualifiers last September but, sadly for the young midfielder, 1 win from 3 games meant the Vilki failed to progress to the elite stage later this year