Variable speed limits on the M25

So I may have been misinformed, but I was always under the impression that the motorway speed cameras, (especially on the M25), were set for a 70mph speed limit and only flashed when you went over 80ish, (in all my years driving motorways I've hardly ever seen a camera flash). I'd always assumed that they were unable to enforce the variable speed limits, so if the signs are saying 50mph and you are still going at 70 then you'd be OK. Again I've done this for years with no flashes or tickets.

This has changed.

Someone in the office has been given 3 points for doing 74 when the signs were saying 60 on the M25. The new smart cameras, (which are everywhere now), can adjust to match the overhead speed signs. Looking into this today it seems that these are legally enforceable as the variable speed limits are digitally recorded and matched to the cameras.

So even if the motorway is clear and the signs say 50, don't go over 50 or it's a minimum of 3 points and a fine, plus 5 years of telling your insurance about it.

 

Most of the gantries have the camera sign and thee painted lines after them but not all gantries have the cameras. The bit I use most is between J21a and J22 and between these junctions there are two gantries with cameras each way, I've seen the cameras flash on the other carriageway before.

Since my first speeding offence in January I've been a lot more careful on the motorway now, and since I've had my new car it has a limiter function to prevent you from accidentally speeding if you set it. I was doing 89mph on the M40 and got 3 points and £100 fine, the points stay on for 4 years not 5.

In the last couple of weeks there was some legislation passed through parliament meaning that all cameras on all roads including the motorway gantry cameras must be painted yellow or orange and are visible. This must be done by a certain date next year (which I can't remember).

 

Until recently the cameras switched off at 70 and you could do what you wanted. This is now not the case, local police can turn them on at 70 if them deem it necessary. As usual there is no guidelines to what is or isn't necessary, so collecting money for plod's xmas do would probably be considered.

Also there's no need for a flash these days either. The digital cameras even work in the dark without.

Unfortunately the motorist is seen as a soft target for revenue generation and this is only set to get worse. Especially as you consider it has been proved that speeding is not the main cause of accidents and installation of cameras in accident blackspots makes little to no difference.

Pistonheads is a good resource for this sort of thing:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/forum.asp?h=0&f=10&mid=0

 

I've been driving 35 years and never had a speeding ticket. If it says 30, I go 30. If it says 50, I go 50. Can't afford a speeding ticket. It'd ruin us.

Plus as well, it's gratifying when you come around the corner in a 30 zone and see a cop with a camera on a tripod (like they do in the villages) or the van by the side of the road with them filming out the back doors. "Morning officer! Hope you catch some miscreants!" and then flash everyone coming the other way like crazy.

 

I thought it was 3? The insurance companies will still ask you about any motoring offences in the last 5 years.

 

I'm afraid this is old news Diamond. The M1 and M6/M42 cameras have worked like this for years now though they may just have upgraded the M25 ones, I'm not sure. Don't be fooled that when the signs are off the cameras are off too. They're not. If no speed limit is displayed the cameras enforce the national speed limit.

That said the prosecution threshold remains 10% + 2mph over the speed limit. Keep on or below that and you won't get caught by a fixed camera or a camera van.

Not quite. It's not legislation, it was just an edict by the Transport Secretary and it just covers the cameras on the strategic road network which are owned by central government. And in reality a fat lot of good that will be as most of those cameras are attached to the backside of gantries so quite well obscured. I can spot them in advance but most people who get caught now still will be.

 

It used to be 3 years, but I think it changed to 4 when the driving awareness course was introduced as an alternative. Unfortunately as I was going over 86 the course wasn't available to me.

 

Cheers UEA, I hadn't looked into it until today when my colleague showed us the letter. I'm just shocked I hadn't been caught so wanted to warn everyone else.

The 10% +2mph is not true though, as I myself was done at 34mph in a 30mph zone. This was on the middlesex/herts border.

 

Clive, have you ever played the game Lemmings? I think you'd like it!

 

The 10%+2 rule is allow for the variable in case the vehicle's speedometer is incorrect it's not a licence to drive at 35mph in a 30 zone.

When I got my letter in January from the Thames Valley Police on the reverse it listed the speed limits and the speed window for which the course was available for:

Limit 30, course 35-42, automatic points 43+
Limit 40, course 46-53, automatic points 54+
Limit 50, course 57-64, automatic points 65+
Limit 60, course 68-75, automatic points 76+
Limit 70, course 79-86, automatic points 87+

So if it stated 34 you should have challenged it.

 

On a slightly different note - the average speed cameras infesting the M1 and other trunk routes are 95% forward facing, and so cannot get motorcycles which don't have a front plate. So, as a matter of courtesy, when driving at 50 in an average speed zone, please stay in the left hand lanes so we two wheelers can speed down the right hand lanes with impunity.

Thank you.

 

When was that? The 10% + 2mph thing has only been formalised in the last two years, maybe less. Before that it was applied ad hoc around the country dependent on the police force area.

 

It's once in 3 years for the course.

 

6 or 7 years back, that would explain it.

 

I got nicked doing 72 in a 60 (a 70 zone reduced to 60 as some cones were out, no work going on of course...) but it was in Scotland and they don't do the driver awareness course up there - just a straight fine and 3 points.

 

It's strange that speeding is a law that many people don't mind breaking. Is there a inbuilt urge to go fast or is it simply becasue our current limits need updating?

Bearing in mind they were set when stopping distances were 3x longer than they are now and car manufacture is stronger and safer.

I'd call for a raise where safe on Motorways to 90 maybe urban side streets 20 main suburban roads 40. Lets face it, they're the speeds people travel these days anyway.

 

I had cause to drive through Southall this morning, and there's a 20mph stretch on the main road with a speed camera for good measure. All I needed was a man with a red flag in front of me and I'd have been back to the dawn of car manufacturing. 20mph is too slow, especially for a bleedin main road.

 

Tell that to the people who are generally infront of me

Agreed. Side streets and dead ends it's fair but main through fares, wide enough for parking both sides as many are should be 40. Is 20 actually enforceable?

 

My other half got flashed at 58 on the M25 in that exact circumstance (variable speed limit down to 50, all lanes open, no problems in sight and very little traffic, return to national speed limit sign visible in a hundred yards or so) so it's a bit less than 61. Luckily she was able to do the awareness course rather than collect the points. Still put over £100 onto the annual insurance..

 

With the greatest respect , this makes me happy , i always slow to the variable limit being issued , and it usually results in some tosspiece stuck up your backside

 

Why would you do that?

 

Do kids not run out from between parked cars on throughfares then?

I know from experience they do on the holloway road for example , the difference between 40 and 20 is more than likely death , does that not bother you at all?

 

If you increase the speed limit to 40, ***** will go 50. Just follow the bloody rules.

 

Will they ever raise the speed limit on motorways? Is there any reason why we haven't do date - for example, what is the safety record of other countries with faster motorway speed limits? 70 feels relatively slow, especially with cars being much safer. Why not try 80?

On another note, I would like to see minimum speed limits introduced on roads. Too often am I stuck behind some someone plodding around at 25mph on a 40mph road that's not easy to overtake on. It's infuriating.

On a final note, today at Sainsburys in Apsley I saw a guy get hit by a car at the zebra crossing driven by an old lady - only grazed, but hit none-the-less. Said old lady proceeded to find a parking spot and drove straight into the post at the front of it. Had the post not been there she'd have hit another person. Clearly unsafe to drive. I know you have to retake at a certain age but this lady should not have been behind the wheel.

 

The original post I made was with my own experience of a variable limit with no safety issues going faster than that due to lack of other cars. I've always done this when safe to do so thinking the cameras were fixed at 80+. I agree that through the 50mph roadworks, (especially on the M3), there is always some ar*e right behind you even with 3 lanes available.

 

Of course it does, what an odd conclusion to jump to.

I'm taking busy through fares rather than residential streets. I don't know the Holloway Road so can't comment but it's the responsibility of parents to teach their kids not to run into the road. If they're not old enough to understand and observe that, they're not old enough to be unattended.

 

I know someone who was "done" for speeding while she was on her way to a speed awareness course. Quality.

 

Everyone has a responsibility to ensure safety , parents , the kids and drivers , and how is it an odd conclusion , you want to go 40 on thoroughfares , thoroughfares often run through built up areas , ergo , you are up for helping kill pedestrians

 

Bring back the Tufty Club!

 

The stats below are from the Department of Transport and show the number/percentage of 'incidents' since 2013 to 2014.

The number of fatalities where the driver was travelling at 20mph are up 367%.
The number of fatalities where the driver was travelling at 30mph are up 13%.
The number of fatalities where the driver was travelling at 40mph are down 13%.
The number of fatalities where the driver was travelling at 50mph are up 15%.
The number of fatalities where the driver was travelling at 60mph are down 3%.
The number of fatalities where the driver was travelling at 70mph are down 8%.

Speed is not the main reason for deaths on British roads, its other things like lack on concentration, chatting, changing radios, mobile phones, smoking, kids playing and running into road, footballs rolling into roads and swerving, weather etc

 

How odd


anyways , if you are playing with your mobile and you hit someone at 40 , you`ll hurt them far more than if your playing with your mobile and your going 20

its not possible to argue against that fact , speed kills , any other viewpoint is nonsense

 

On the other hand, I'd imagine people are more likely to start using their phone at the 'safe' speed of 20mph than at 40mph, due to frustration, boredom and perceived levels of danger.

Swings and roundabouts.

 

Maybe more people play with their mobile if they are going at 20, thinking they are safe to do so.

Mobiles kill!