But 71% of people who voted Tory think it was the right decision. So the goons up for PM are chasing this vote. However ... if 22% of Tory voters think it was wrong, and 83% of Labour voters think it was wrong, why the hell is Starmer pandering to the ****wits?
Yup, it's not healthy and we're in dire need of someone to break that cycle. And while it was obvious to anyone with half a brain in 2019 that Brexit could never just be 'done' because Boris willed it to be, I find it pretty disheartening the Tories haven't moved on as a party and seem intent on fighting the next few elections on it too.
We did have that at the time with the talk of the confirmatory referendum but that was drowned out in by the "THEY'RE TRYING TO STEAL YOUR BREXIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" coverage. This is going to poison our politics for generations. It will probably see the end of the UKIP Tory party as we know it.
I thought a vote for the Lib Dems at the next GE would at least be a protest vote for reintegration with the EU, but I heard Daisy Cooper trying to explain their 73 stage plan for a closer relationship with Europe a few weeks ago. I don't think I can wait that long. Will the Greens have a "rejoiner" manifesto?
It's really odd that it appears that all the failings of Brexit are the fault of the people who didn't vote for it! https://twitter.com/Otto_English/status/1549148640450682881
It is odd. People like Tice will complain about "remoaners" whining about Brexit while spending a large part of their time whining about how we've not got the Brexit they voted for. They will celebrate getting Brexit done while complaining that Brexit is not done because of the NI protocol. It's truly bizarre. I must admit that one of the biggest revelations of Brexit for me is the inability of some people to accept their responsibility for voting for it rather than to continue to blame it on anyone and everyone else.
I urge @iamofwfc and @zztop and @Lloyd and @HenryHooter and @davycrockett and any other fool still blissfully thinking that Brexit is wonderful to watch this. This is the Cabinet Office's guide to selling to the EU. It replaces "phone UPS; hand over parcel".
You still don't get what Brexit was about. It is not about your capitalist concerns, or what tangible benefits you get. Thought I had said that enough times. Is this the same way the EU trade with every other third country? If so, I imagine all is well.
Excellent will make the stuff cheaper here due to lack of demand and solve the cost of living problems. Hurrah!
Brexit was entirely about one thing: getting Boris into number 10. Anything else and I'm sorry but you've been had.
It was about giving the people what they voted for in the referendum. And for that anyone who believes in democracy should be grateful to Boris
Ah, that great exercise in democracy when hedge fund owners, assorted toffs and newspaper proprietors convince the population to do something daft because of fears of immigration and a misplaced idea of sovereignty. I guess it’s what the wise, ancient Greeks had in mind when they dreamt it up.
From the amount of whining that emanates from "leading Brexiters", it doesn't appear that the people got what they voted for. And that was always one of the problems. People had numerous reasons for voting to leave the EU and had multiple visions of what a post Brexit UK would look like. A percentage (probably a majority) of those that voted Brexit were never going to get "what they voted for". Of course all those that voted remain are getting what they voted against!
A majority voted to leave the EU in the referendum. The tories won the last election with a huge majority on a platform of getting Brexit done. Whatever it has turned out to be any form of Brexit is better for our democracy than no Brexit at all
You strike me as the kind of person who, when things don’t work out, simply bounces straight up smiling again. Time for you to do just that. Just face it, Brexit isn’t going to get better or lead to anything more. It’s a dead end. Sure the vote should have been respected, but it’s done and those flogging the allegedly pure form of it now, with their unicorn dreams of eternal UK paradise are parasites. We cannot get by without trade with Europe. We must have tarriff free trade. They are bigger than us and so we will never be able to cherry pick their rules. We need to gracefully accept enough of them to make the situation work so we can move on and prosper. We don’t need to go back and we don’t need to chase rainbows. The Tory Party is going to learn this the very hard way if it continues to allow its agenda to be set by a handful of bonehead eurosceptics and a few newspaper owners.
I don't disagree but the simple majority requirement and ill defined referendum meant that the outcome is fundamentally undemocratic too. It is undeniable that the Brexit we have ended up with is not what the vast majority of the population wanted. But you are correct. Once the simple majority referendum was agreed then some kind of Brexit was necessary for democracy. It would have been better if the fundamentalist ERG loons hadn't taken over though and further consultation (and yes, a second referendum) on what people wanted from Brexit had happened under May.
I'm not arguing that Brexit has been a rip-roaring success. I'm simply making the point that after a majority voted for it twice failure to deliver it would cause more problems than any of the issues arising since we left the EU
It's been delivered (sort of) and it's shyte. Which even you agree with. So what's the problem with taking steps to reverse some of the most egregious damage?
If in, say, 10 years aspects still aren't working, nothing at all. This has to be seen as a long term project. Of course as Keynes once pointed out in the future we'll all be dead
The Brexit people voted for was independence from the EU. We got that. Ask anyone that simple question, why did you vote for Brexit, and that is the answer you will get. People didn't specify anything else when they voted. Pretty sure I would be able to say that you lot didn't get the remain you voted for, had you won, and it would be equally meaningless as what you say here. It is remainer cope for the fact they lost; "people didn't know what they voted for". Yes they did. Independence.
Daftest argument of all, and one based on a fundamental misunderstanding of what the EU is and how it works. Britain *was* the EU. One of the big three players, leading it, shaping it, dragging its heels when it didn’t want certain things, and with a powerful list of vetoes to boot. To walk away from that and believe it has led to some spurious independence from a body that Britain literally led and shaped is so bizarre but, well, you got what you voted for. Enjoy it. Decades of mendacious reporting led to a narrow mandate. I don’t doubt that the people who voted leave think they were voting for independence but they were utterly wrong. Now they’ve won it, they have to put up with it being absolutely rubbish. But then so do the rest of us.
Why, exactly, does it have to be seen as a long-term project? The people proposing this are of course desperate that their obviously stupid choice should avoid judgement. None of the trade deals we have done are actually beneficial, let alone anywhere close to making up for what we've lost. The only deal that could have made even a small dent in the loss would be the USA and that looks to be a no-go for the foreseeable on both sides of the house. So what do you see getting better in the next 'say' 10 years? And on what basis?
Ostrich. You haven't got an answer. Don't worry, we see you. So we'll just keep going for 10 years while the cost of brexit, estimated by the OBR to be >£40bn to the exchequer a year and growing at 4% PA, until we wake up in 2032 a vastly diminished country and finally accept the error. Except people like Rees Mogg and yourself will drawl "well, it's impossible to prove that we would have done any better in the EU..."
