Of course it is. The whole club has been sold as a stepping stone to players and they are now invoking their agreements to move on, simple as that. I really doubt the owner and board have ever sold the club as anything other than a place to pitch up for a couple of years and then move on.They won't have been appealing for players to buy into the fabric of the club - we've set about buying a load of 'individuals' over the past few years and there's clearly been very little thought put into actually building a 'team' that will fight through thick and thin. Very little scouting seems to be done on a players character or human traits - making a quick buck seems to be where the scouting starts and ends.
My planned season-long boycott of televised football lasted until 7.44 last night. God, I wish I wasn't so feeble. Hugely depressing on so many levels. The performance, the squad - even the kit if you half closed your eyes - took me back to the Perryman/Lee/Roeder years. Given Ken Sema's quality cross for our goal and generally tidy contribution and Ben Wilmot's steady display at the back, why were they shipped out last season? Both could have given us something at various times and surely both could have offered more than bloody Mariappa. We might even have picked up the single, solitary effing point that would have kept us up and saved us from a year (at least) of this sh1te.
yes I googled COG and am still not sure but I think it’s probably Church of God or Consistent Orgasm Giver, same thing I guess.
I don't think it's a question of players refusing to play, but it's Ivic's stance on the situation. He only wants players involved if they are truly committed. I get that, and I can't blame him for taking that approach, but it's an idealistic notion I don't think we can really afford. I'm sure he didn't want to play Kiko, but he had to because he didn't really have choice. While we have these players, we have to use them. Even if it's for a bit of menace from the bench. Seeing Sarr or Welbeck sitting there, will be far more concerning to Warnock than seeing Sinclair. It's crazy we're not using these players. We got away with it last night, but I think we'll fall into a mid-table category if we continue selecting a side similar to the one we picked last night over a period of matches.
I think it means your confused and an individual with free will. Alas , not a good combination as no one will like you for your individuality. Although paradoxically you could be the messiah who will bring the opposing Hornet factions together by uniting them in their contempt for you.
You may be right, but one can still be frustrated that a culture has developed whereby players getting anywhere between €20k and €50k per week are not available to work for their employers (obviously excluding injured players). I just don’t accept that it is appropriate to be happy for them to be marginalised if they don’t demonstrate commitment and passion. I would find it far more acceptable if they were denied their wages for the period they lack this commitment. Wholly unrealistic, I know. My real gripe is the lack of integrity or professionalism shown by pampered boys. This is not unique to our club or the sport of football. If I was changing jobs, I would like to think that I would carry out my duties as long as my current employer is paying me. Different worlds.
I think many people are reading a lot, too much, into one game, at the start of the season, in very unusual international times, and obviously some weird squad goings on, from a lot of young players and a new coach. Let’s give them a few games before we fly off the handle. I dont think this is the settled squad we will see all year or anything like it
Ha, I did notice that as well. It did suggest he might have been uncomfortable answering the question. He did seem to word his answer carefully still, rather than just lying - there were a few pertinent pauses.
Could have just been a negotiation tactic - easier to demand more money for players you're keen to keep than ones you demonstrate are not really needed. The club might have been saying they'll only sell if other clubs meet their asking price, in which case they'd have to involve them until then. Perhaps it was only just this week that clubs have put in serious offers, forcing us to take them out. With some of our other players leaving it has been much clearer that they wanted out, we'd be happy to move them on, and we wouldn't be getting much for them anyway, so involving them in the squad would have been less necessary.
I agree with all of that and yes as you point out it’s unfortunately unrealistic. So maybe me saying happy for them to be marginalised is not the best choice of words and what I meant to say was “in this moment“ it would be best for our chances of success for them to be marginalised.
Also we turned his head last season!! How many times does this c***'s head rotate?!??!? His last 2 seasons in the PL have ended in relegation. He's not good enough, didnt he get the effin memo??
Wouldn't surprise me if he is one who doesn't fancy the hard training. And also played under old school managers like Pulis and Pearson so not used to the overseas manager.
I can’t reconcile how you view it like that. Surely the team that played last night is as weak as it will be? We won’t sell all our better players, but as sure as night follows day some will go, that’s the reality of the situation. But when the music stops some will still be here and be integrated into the team, that’s not even allowing for any additional signings. To equate a 1-0 win to a 3-0 loss under such circumstances makes absolutely no sense.
We're extremely unlikely to be shipping out 17 players. Transfer market is hardly buzzing at the minute.
I have to apologise to you @Jumbolina, I’d been in the pub since four so I can see most of my posts to you were stupid. I’m not as negative as you about last night, but with the benefit of sobriety I can see it wasn’t a great performance.
It could be weaker. If we go down the "fire sale" route, as appears to be the case, I wouldn't think the likes of Foster or Hughes would waste their time staying with us. With the news that it looks like we're prepared to sell our young talent as well as the senior stars, it really gives little hope that we are going to give it a right good go this season. Where's the ambition? The omens look bad, and yesterday's lineup is the shape of things to come I suspect.
Hughes wasn’t playing last night, granted we might lose Foster but I don’t see that as disaster. I can’t see who else from the starting lineup we could possibly lose, so it can only really get stronger. We’ve got a new talented coach, we couldn’t defend for **** last season or score from set pieces, yesterday we scored an excellent set piece and defended exceptionally, Evidence already that the coach has had a huge impact. Personally I can only really see us getting better from here, I like after Brighton last season when the season was pretty much downhill even from there.
That’s football now and much else is a myth. Someone like Capoue’s loyalty to us, his seasons of consistent service are not far off as good as it gets. And as for never buying into the DNA quite a few have stayed and took us despite evident frailties, to the top half and a cup final for a fleeting moment. It’s all very well identifying it, but no good if the answer is simply ‘get your chequebook out Gino’.
Precisely. It all stems back decades and decades ago to when clubs were predominantly made up of players from their region, and a lot of the players were genuine supporters of the club. Way back then it was reasonable to expect some loyalty, but those days have long since gone. It’s no more reasonable to expect ‘loyalty’ from a footballer, than it would be for anyone on this board to turn down a big pay rise and a host of other benefits over loyalty to their current employer. Edit: I’d also add, how anyone could expect loyalty from any of players I’m not sure. We show no loyalty to managers when things go wrong, we ship players out on loan, we look to sell them as soon as they lose form (iggy). Those aren’t really criticisms of the club, it’s just the way it is, but we as a club rarely involve sentiment in any decisions so why would any of our players.
Some also seem to be overlooking this - Bournemouth have faced the same issues with their players, look at Fraser last season, and King in this one for instance. Brentford also aren't using Benrahma.
Just a wild guess: Bachmann Navarro Sierralta Kabasele Stephenson Dele-Bashiru Chalobah Phillips Penaranda Murray Sinclair
Found a lot of people on that Boro forum say that we have potentially the best defence in the Championship, which I found interesting. Obviously there's only so much you can take from one game (though admittedly I did see a few of those comments pre-game), but is it a case of them not being familiar enough with us, or is it a case of us being too harsh? (Think Ivic will get a tune out of whoever plays there regardless)
for the championship. As set out yesterday it’s a decent defence. We aren’t in the premiership anymore. If we go up then yes it needs a complete overhaul. some people need to adjust their perspective
