Tottenham Hotspur 4-0 Watford FC - 08/04/2017

HB1's going up :jumping1:

 

I'm one of Walter's most vocal critics. Yesterday, I can't complain.

I thought we started extremely well and for 15-20 mins matched Spurs and caused them problems.

Heads did drop at 3-0 down but I can see why; they'd scored three superb goals.

I watched the game with 4 or 5 others in the pub and we all expected a loss. Nothing lost, plenty gained hopefully in experience and lessons learnt.

The only criticism is Amrabat on more than one occasion not getting tight to his man allowing Tottenham to play and fashion chances. Apart from that, as others said it was a free hit.

Onto the next one. If we win next Saturday we're 100% safe in my book.

 

I hate to say it, but I have a sneaking feeling that success might be a pile of droppings.

 

Ah, now, that's a point more deserving of debate.

If we only keep one of Niang or Success... which one would you want ?

 

You are one strange individual

 

I made the cut! :jumping1:

 

Whilst we are both being civil then, what you say raises a few other issues I would say...

We have progressed enormously, and the only measure we have to look to is the general attitude to Mazzarri. Only a few are calling for his head still, and in general, though people are not delighted with the football, he is viewed positively, and I think most expect him to be here next season. Quique, even with the cup run, was a walking dead man. We don't know what Gino is thinking, and he may still go; I'd say its 70/30 even if we finish strongly.

That is a fair opinion. I don't agree with it, but I appreciate why you may say it. But, and this is the reason I copied your WBA review above, it is completely at odds with what you said in that review, in which you very fairly said that You believed one more win would make us safe, in which case dreadful defeats in all the other games wouldn't make any difference. You also said you did not expect us to win against Spuds, and even speculated we could get tonked. That quantum leap from one point of view to another is frustrating for anyone trying to have a structured conversation, and because you defend the last thing you say as if you said nothing before it, people are going to get upset. I am explaining the frustration, not having a go here.

It is not devastating, but it is significant. Like the top teams, we don't buy players to battle, we buy them to use their technical ability. Not being able to play them regularly, particularly, as you say, the absolute key creative players, is going to affect your game, both in terms of quality and ability to play the game you want to play. It is not devastating, as Mazzarri has proven, but it is hugely significant, and there will be very few fans who say otherwise. I would suggest that anyone that does will probably turn out not to be much of a Walter fan.

 

The main reason I want Watford to win next Saturday has got nothing thing to do with winning points, but to increase the chance that HB1 won't be posting .

 

My response is in bold.

 

You'd better beat Swansea, or else you're going down mate.

 

You say injuries haven't had an effect but how many times have we had early in games and had to change our game plan, how many players have come off injured thus preventing use of subs for tactical reasons and you seem to have forgotten our time in January when Amrabat injured. Okaka injured, Success injured , Pererya injured and before Niang and Karate came in, what attacking options exactly did Mazzarri have then? Injuries and suspensions to players at the back have also meant we have rarely played the same back line from game to game so have been unable to build up a proper understanding.
We gave it a proper go on Saturday and we're undone by some quality goals from Spurs and probably suffering from tiredness after playing much of second half on Tuesday with 10 men

Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk

 

We're pretty much safe now but a point against either Swansea or Hull will make certain


Stop whinging!

 

I think he is very aware.

 

HB1 is your classic Internet forum attention seeker .

An intelligent version of SS Billy , basically.

 

I guess we know why we get so many yellow cards now.

 

For the record, I believe HB1 makes some very valid points and gets a lot of stick for them.

He's entitled to his opinions (I agree with a lot of them), as is everyone else.

 

My head says niang, my heart says success..

I just can't help feeling he's going to be one of those players we invest all our hope in only for him to let us down in the end. The 2017 version of my beloved Jamie moralee.

Obviously I hope and pray this isn't the case, as I love the big galoot. His goal v Bournemouth is my favourite moment of this season so far.

 

If Niang can get his attitude right then he can become a top player .

Success has got the attributes to be the same but is a couple of years behind Niang in terms of development, tactical understanding, positioning etc

But then Niang has been playing Ligue 1 football since he was 16 whereas Success has only had 18 months at Granada .

 

Success just needs a brain. He's a few years behind Niang not only in age but also experience which brings with it decision making.

 

With Niang it feels like he needs games so he go somewhere big again and we're his shop window. Success will be around for a little while yet I think.

 

Fair opinion re Mazzarri, I have been reading things a bit different, but I think you have a good point. But as you seemed as appeased by the WBA game as the best of us (see your WBA review), I am sure you understand how easy it is.

Which is true and reflects your WBA review, however, your most recent comment was...

Which is an opinion stated as a fact. Include the words 'I fear' or 'we could be' and all of a sudden no one will be arguing with you. It is at odds with your review, because one bad defeat, which we were all expecting at Spuds, makes no difference to the remaining games.

I know, that is my whole point in saying that you argue like you'd never stated your previous opinion. It is good to hear you say this because we can now understand that you start after each game with a clean slate, regardless of what point you spent three days arguing over after the last game. Most of this forum know, but when it has been pointed out to you in the past, you have not been pleased to hear it said, though you are now declaring it yourself. Basically you are saying you are bound to have a different opinion after each game, but unfortunately, rather than not forecasting beyond the next game, when everyone knows your opinion will change, you forecast the rest of the season, or that Walter will lose his job if things don't change, which is absolutely fair enough; unless you are going defend that point to the death, before ignoring it after the next game. Seriously, that's not having an opinion, that is having an emotion.

So you are clearly saying it is not a crisis (I would be very interested to hear you say that at an "at our place" event, and hope you will take the the opportunity when it next comes up). Because in your WBA review you said something which I thought was very magnanimous at the time, and I fully respected you for saying it, I think I might even have 'liked' the post for it...

Which appears to be at odds with not only your WBA review, but also...

I have to ask if you understand my point now?

So what changed at Spuds? Well, it turned out, exactly how you predicted, to be a bit of a defensive crisis against probably the best striking team in the country. I don't know a fairer way to point this out to you, and I hope you do not take offence, or think I have twisted your words.

Please don't get upset. This is not meant as a put down, it is to help you understand why people can get frustrated on occasion.

 

I agree. HB1 makes some excellent points, and he expresses some very fair opinions at times, but there are occasions where I strongly disagree with one, the other, or both, and he doesn't like it when I discuss it with him. On some occasions I agree with him strongly, particularly about issues with Walter, but do not agree with his stating opinion as fact (which I always feel weakens an argument rather than strengthen it), and it is usually then that we have a long conversation.

Contrary to what he thinks, and I guess you too, I actually quite like him: I don't tend to take offence when it comes to disagreement, and enjoy debate.

 

I guess you're not a fan?

 

Unsurprisingly you didn't understand.

 

Sorry if it's been mentioned alreay, but not sure that I have seen both teams captained by 'keepers before.......

 

I guess you don't fancy responding to my post?

 

Bournemouth being dismantled.

 

They must be worse than I thought, fancy letting in four against a rubbish team like Spurs.

 

But...but...but...

HB1 said they had more fight and guts than us. I watched it and...
he was wrong!