Do you think we suffered worse than Southampton? I disagree, both teams had a bad call today and both teams can have a justifiable reason for complaint.
No, that’s exactly my point. You said that we are at a massive disadvantage. Well, so are they on today’s evidence. If you are saying that 14 teams lose out relative to the top six, well - I have some sympathy with that view. But when it comes to matches between those 14: I think every team is treated the same. Equally incompetently, today.
I think you misunderstood my point. I was talking about Watford in general, being an unfashionable club is a massive disadvantage. Nothing to do about this particular match.
Charlie Austin needs to engage his brain before opening his mouth. VAR you say Mr.Austin ? Well in that case we would have had a clear case for a penalty. Not only that by the letter of the law a second yellow card for Ryan Bertrand and a sending off too. And as for the antics of your fellow team mates Manolo and Per do have a word. It's a rather pathetic sight to see grown men barely touched in the face and the back rolling around as if they have been mortally wounded. Shameful behaviour. And a pity too that such players cannot be banned and fined heavily.
So in what sense is it a disadvantage? You started out by asking why we should suffer a rookie referee. So did Southampton. It’s only a disadvantage relative to the top six, isn’t it? I’m not belittling that, but 13 other clubs could say exactly the same. It’s not peculiar to us.
Really HB who cares what pundits, the media hype bandwagon led by BT and Sky and the associated tabloids who have created this entertainment circus think. So long as we stay in the divison, stay solvent, play attacking football and continue to develop as a club on and off the pitch that is all that matters. I could not care one whit what Frankenstein's assistant says and why they get paid a fortune for stating the blindingly obvious on television beats me.
Yes...I agree with you. Not sure why you are making these points......but I can only think you've totally misunderstood my post. Both sides suffered the ref today. IMO it's a disadvantage being an unfashionable club because no one cares about giving you a rough ride. The attitude towards this type of club is really bad. If you're a big club, or fashionable club, or a media darling, you get so much more in terms of favourable decisions or glowing reporting. Again, and I stress this, I am talking in general terms, not this game.
I care because it seeps into the psyche of everyone in the game, including officials. I believe this is the reason behind so many poor decisions we tend to get. I just want fairness right across the board. I want to see consistency, not favouritism. The only way we can achieve this, IMO, is using VAR. It would clear up so many things. I don't care if we lose out on VAR on occasions, because I know over an entire season we would be massive beneficiaries.
Ok, fair enough. I feel (I suspect others do too) that sometimes you see prejudice against us on some occasions when perhaps it isn’t really there, and all I was trying to say was that today’s game rather proves the point that we not the only club that gets a rough ride. Sounds like we are singing from the same hymnsheet. Out of interest, do you feel that the same applies in La Liga (to the benefit of the club, you support, of course)?
The season feels like it's going to be much like the others, too good to ever really be in a serious relegation battle, never quite good enough to be best of the rest. Maybe everything's okay and it's just the grey weather and rain making me a miserable git
Well I agree with you that referees need help and technology might make them more consistent with their decisions and remove sentiment and unconscious bias from it. I mean the booking of Gray last week and Bamba not being booked for taking off his shirt this is one minor example. But the bigger clubs have unfortunately always have had the benefit and that includes Barcelona as many smaller clubs in La Liga will testify. And we also do get the rub of the green at times. Doucoure's handball equalizer last season. I think if we took more of the chances we created and were not so profligate referees decisions would have a much smaller effect on us.
Some of our passing across the back today reminded me of the Mazzarri days ... Mariappa looks like he doesn't know what to do except pass back to Foster (and Foster kept us in the game with a couple of reflex saves). Deeney coming on gave us a boost - his leadership, commitment: how many premier league players go and sit amongst the crowd at the end of a game and give away their boots and shirt? What has happened to Doucoure these last few weeks
I see everything objectively, with a slight rose tint. My observations are more in general, but I think you assumed it was just about today's match. Today, both teams were shafted because of the appointed official. I said why should Watford suffer this, because I'm not a spokesman for Southampton. They would never assign a referee like this to Man Utd v Man City, so why should we and Southampton suffer him? In La Liga the standard of refereeing is vastly superior. We do not have these joke officials as there seems to be in the Premier League. I don't like them all, but they are all of a much better standard of decision making. In terms of Barcelona they tend to beat everyone anyway, so a good or bad decision doesn't have the same impact for Barca as it does for Watford. Watford cannot overcome a bad decision very often whereas Barca can.
I have to say, I love the way Javi conducts his interviews. He's always the same. He never gets emotional and is always measured. There is never a dig or sly remark at anyone. I think his approach is winning a lot of admirers. https://www.skysports.com/football/...javi-gracia-plays-down-st-marys-controversies
Regarding the penalty, I looked directly at the ref the moment the foul occurred and he looked at the penalty spot. I would have bet my shirt that he would have then pointed to the spot, but something stopped him. A terrible decision from what I saw. Anyway, it's done. We got a bit of luck back with Holebas's shot which took enough of a deflection to put it over their keepers hand and into the net. It was only after that that we showed a bit of desire, the one thing that was seriously lacking today. Oh yes, it's cold and wet.
We were poor today. Southampton style of football would leave me looking for another hobby each season. Awful to watch. Mariappa has had some good games, but his time is up - he s a Championship player at best. Chalobah looks finished as a player. Watch the way he runs and movement. We did look as if we had 10 men with him playing. No free flowing football from Watford l have read about.. We looked tired and lacked any ideas. They just sat back as they do under Hughes as Manager and soaked up our high ball tactics today. Good support from the fans watching two poor sides.
I know Holebas scored but he stilled played absolutely *****. He should be nowhere near the starting line up, again **** corners/free kicks/throw ins Also... Doucoure crap without Capoue Chalobah bloody awful but to be excused as it was his first game back Del 7 & Bobby P need rockets up their arses Hopefully Tom Clev will be Fit after the international bore break Although Deeney done alright when he came on, I still think we’re a better team without him, hopefully Javi will stick with success up front
The hysterics that is coming out of Southampton is baffling. I get it that they feel hard done by over the goal, but have Watford gone over the top about the penalty and red card? Watford have kept their own council, shrugged their shoulders and accepted it. I think there are going to be a lot of fines handed out to Southampton in the week. They have a right to be angry, but they have to be balanced about it.
That is extremely harsh on a player who has been out for almost a season and has hardly played any first team football. It will take him a while to get back into the swing of things. If after some thirty games he is still playing at this level then we will know if the patella injury is hampering him. Bobby P also struggled for a while but is now back to his best. We cannot simply throw people under the bus after one game. Fickleness does not befit us.
Well that was probably the weirdest afternoon I've ever had on the south coast. Miserable weather, and a pretty miserable place all told. Not sure I would want to live in Southampton, but the locals seemed friendly enough and I hear the nightlife is exceptional. Anyone onto more important footballing issues. For the second game in a row we looked tired, lacklustre and devoid of ideas. We created several good openings in the first 20 minutes, and I don't think Saints fans could have felt aggrieved if we had taken the lead. However Deulofeu's finishing leaves something to be desired and he made the wrong choice on several occasions today (particularly evident in the second half when he was given a right rollicking by Troy). Pereyra was uncharacteristically off the boil today and at fault for their goal, just dig it out ffs bobby. Game changed for the better when Troy came on and despite the penalty fiasco and the disallowed goal I thought a draw was a pretty fair result. Foster - made a great save in the first half at 1 down to keep us in it, however his distribution at times is absolutely ****ing dire. 6/10 Femenia - thought he did well enough today, not exceptional but solid and tried to get forward when the chances presented themselves. 6/10 Cathcart - poor again today, headless chicken on the ball and just seemed to continually try 50/50 passes to space in the middle of the pitch. Would love to see what his completed pass percentage was, but he is not a ball playing defender and never will be. I think he misses Kabasele. 5/10 Mariappa - can never doubt his effort and made some important blocks but I expect Kabasele to be back after the international break. 6/10 Holebas - really worked hard today, although his set piece delivery is so damn hit and miss. Can be thoroughly frustrating, but when the ball came to him in the box I instantly knew he would bury it. Liked his celebration too, very passionate. 7/10 Hughes - terrible. Really off the boil. I would drop him next game, and help him get his spark back. 4/10 Chalobah - didn't look match fit and suffered for it. However did earn the stonewall penalty and did some nice things with the ball. I firmly believe he will come good and that he definitely needed this game. 6/10 Doucoure - another poor performance, he was simply trying to do too much. Be the hustling box to box midfielder we love, don't try and be that plus the deep lying playmaker and trequartista all in one go, it doesn't work and you look poorer for it. Really missed capoue alongside him today. 5/10 Pereyra - write it off to one of those things, never on it and the ball was bouncing off him at all angles. Very unlike him. Not as bad as Hughes....just. 5/10 Deulofeu - so frustrating. Obviously capable of greatness but in front of goal is like a virgin on prom night firing shots all over the place. Also he needs to work harder on the defensive side of his game, particularly when playing wide. 6/10 Success - actually thought he was one of our better players, always an outlet ball and tried hard to make a difference. 7/10 Deeney - changed the game with a proper captains performance. Needs to start. 7/10 Gray - linked nicely with Deeney but perhaps should have done better with a couple of half chances. 6/10 So all in all a decent point, but like Newcastle another missed opportunity.
Quite. For all of Mariappa’s brave tackles and blocks and good team ethic he can’t be in the team long term if we are to ever seriously improve. The fact he is third choice, and now seemingly second choice reflects the complacency of the club towards the centre back position over the last 2 seasons. They really need to upgrade this area or it will forever hold us back.
Deulofeu did it too, feigned an elbow where there wasn't one, then spent the next few minutes wandering around holding the back of his head.
Disagree with this. He misplaced a few passes but he was covering so much ground, even more so as Chalobah was pretty much a passenger. Chalobah was more advanced than Doucoure, so the latter was playing the Capoue role as well as trying to drive forwards up the pitch as he usually does.
I know it's all about opinions but baffled that anyone could rate Chalobah's performance today as better than Doucoure's!!
Bought it pre game from a shop. I’m not arguing over something so petty so let’s just agree to disagree and move on.
Doucoure was average but at least he was involved in the game. Other than the penalty incident, the game completely passed Chalobah by. Played in the centre of midfield but made the fewest passes out of anyone to play 90 minutes. Attempted 0 tackles, 0 dribbles, 0 shots, won 1 header.
Good point away. Should have won, we deserved the win and had it not been for our wayward finishing, could have been 3-0 up inside the first 10mins. Glad their goal was disallowed and with no bias, I actually think it’s the correct call. Yoda is interfering with play. Watch Foster legs make a slight adjustment as the ball is near Yoda. He was waiting for the ball to come off him. When it didn’t he was just out of reach from the ball. Without that little movement though, he would have saved it. As others have said, Southampton need a reality check. That passage of play doesn’t even happen if we were awarded a blatant penalty and they go down to 10 men. Their players and fans need to put their big boy pants on and take off their ladies undies, bunch of lumberjacks! Glad we didn’t lose, but again, points dropped against a very poor side that could easily go down this season.
To be fair to their fans, on saintsweb 80% of them are agreeing that while theirs was a goal, we also should have had a pen and them a red card. There are a couple going beserk on there and Twitter but in the main they are being pretty level headed about it all. Theirs was a perfectly good goal too, there is no denying that. In the current state of the law, Yoshida was not interfering. But, ours was a nailed on pen and a second yellow. Even if we'd missed they'd be down to 10 which changes the game. Anyone calling for VAR should realise it would have already changed the game in favour of us.
My 4th away game in row at Soton as I reside nearer to St Mary’s than the ancestral Hornland. Thoughts: Overall a pretty poor performance from us compared to the bench mark of this season. But not to the extent that we still didn’t deserve at least the draw as Soton were poor. Probably my current fave Horn, Bobby B had a mare, ineffectual in offence and failed to clear when required. Deeney, who I confess to having occasionally doubted, made a difference and was good coming on. I like Success and really want him to err succeed. If he can just add a little bit more when it comes to “the crunch” he could be awesome. But he could also easily fade into obscurity. My brain jury is out and doesn’t know what to conclude. Regarding the ref I reckon it sort of even some itself out and it’s case of two wrongs making a right. Austen’s interview is hilarious. After his inauguration at home to Hudders I took my 6 year old to his first away game. Quite challenging for a lazy, occasionally insecure. parent like myself with screwed up trains and sh1te weather to contend with but sort of worked out good in the end to leave me with a warm happy feeling now I am home and have hit the caramel vodka from my freezer. Completely different from my usual away game experience.
I’ve seen the extended highlights and we weren’t as bad as some are making out. Ok the highlights only show the good bits, but we still made several chances. Deulofeu is an excellent player, and is always trying to make things happen. He makes the wrong choice at times and he did miss a very good early chance. Had a couple of other good chances too, and a square ball may have been better than a shot. Pereyra was unlucky in a couple of occasions. He forced a good save from the keeper and almost scored in the penalty incident too. We hit the bar and Gray missed a great header right on full time. Our goal was lucky. A clearance hit Deulofeu and ricoched to Holebas. His shot took a big deflection too. So weren’t good, and this was our worst performance of the season, although the conditions were bad and that does effect how we play. Deeney gave a captain’s performance when he came on, but we missed Capoue.
Well the Southampton bloke did move his head away from the ball to avoid contact so can see why an inexperienced official might think he was involved in the play . Wasn't quite the clear cut error I was expecting which our non penalty was ..
