Lionel Messi

Discussion in 'General Football & Other Sport' started by Smudger, Nov 17, 2010.

  1. If I had the choice of Messi or Maradona playing for Watford I'd choose Maradona
     
  2. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Messi plays in a crap league. As soon as he plays against internationals in a WC he's shown up as bang average.

    Put him in the Championship or the Premier League and see how he fares on a wet Tuesday night at Burnley before going off on one.
     
  3. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    Maradona is a footballing genius. I thought he was untouchable although di Stefano is the greatest all round player (playing in defence midfield and attack). His range of tricks and sheer exuberant flair set him apart. Undoubtedly he had far harder surfaces to play on, tackling that today would merit automatic red cards, that ability to lift his team mates and ability to entertain the crowd while striking the fear of god into opponents.

    But Messi over the last two to three seasons has improved his passing ability to a level that to me is the same now as Maradona. He certainly is not as flashy but with the ball control, dribbling ability at top speed, perfect sense of balance he does not need to employ tricks to get past players. He utilizes the most efficient method and that is reflected in terms of his goal and assist production.

    Maradona played as a deeper midfielder than Messi with genuine strikers infront of him in a league that was miserly in conceding goals. Messi does have a certain advantage in that La Liga is a easier competition in a sense and that he has free reign to score as well create. Both players would have far greater assist totals if their team mates could also actually finish the chances they create.

    There is no doubt Messi can perform all the footballing tricks. And in some games you can see a roulette,stepover and plenty of flicks but most of the time he does not need to use them. Diego from the time he used to entertain the crowd at the Bombonera as a little child loved to play the entertainer.

    And as for the World Cups ? Diego was the extra special ingredient in 1986 but to say Argentina were a poor team is nonsense or that he won it on his own. That team was packed with several top class players from club teams like River and Independiente that had beaten Europe's best consistently. Had he not dabbled in cocaine or been viciously assaulted in every game who knows how many Cups Diego might have won. 1990 Havelange ensured a defeat and with the team playing exceptionally well in 1994 particularly the Redondo-Maradona axis there was that drugs test. 1982 he was simply hacked off the pitch by the Italians notably Gentile and the Brazilians lost his rag and was sent off.

    As for Messi last year was a tremendous disappointment. And to those who watch him on a regular basis he was clearly not fully fit when you see what he has been this season. Not to mention of the fantastic four Aguero and Higuain were also nowhere near one hundred percent match fit or sharp and di Maria was out of the final which hampered his chances for victory (still missed 3 clear cut chances though). He still has one more viable chance in 2018 wherever that is (hopefully here) with a new generation of talent emerging from Argentina.

    A little more entertainment from Maradona:

    [video=youtube;C8Ci5LgBJnA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8Ci5LgBJnA[/video]
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2015
  4. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    So once again after a bitter loss in another final against Chile on penalties (and another involving a huge miss from Gonzalo Higuain) Lionel Messi is bearing the brunt of criticism from fans of the seleccion for somehow not propelling the team to glory. So vitrolic has been some of the attacks on him he himself is considering taking a sabbatical from the national team while fellow team mate and the real leader of the team Mascherano (and I feel more sorry for him) was supposedly thinking of international retirement.

    Some of the blame has to lie with the manager Martino for some poor tactical choices as at Barcelona, a large proportion at the feet of Gonzalo Higuain who should never be allowed to wear a national jersey again (especially with players like Vietto, Icardi, Dybala and Correa about) but one cannot help watching the Copa final Maradona would have run himself into the ground to get over the finishing line.

    I failed to see Lionel demanding the ball or dropping to pick it up when he was needed most and willing to take on the Chilean defence time after time. Admittedly he received far less protection than when playing for Barcelona from the referees but it's only a paltry excuse. Tired ? He was not against Paraguay and if he is desperate for international success at a senior level he should heed his club manager when asked to sit out minor games and be willing to be substituted when asked.

    That lack of success at the international level despite what Menotti says will be held against him by many. However at the club level he remains well in advance of any other player which makes his play for the national team (aside from playing under Sabella) the more frustrating.

    [][​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The sole bright point in the Copa was the link up between Pastore and Messi which bodes well for the future. To be fair to Leo Martino is not the same calibre of coach as Sabella in using Messi as a decoy or getting some of the other players around him aside from Pastore to work better in tandem with him.
     
  5. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    Another well deserved Ballon d'Or is such awards really do hold any real meaning. Still comfortably the best player on the planet and nice to see Paulo 'La Joya' Dybala emerging as another precocious talent at Juventus. The US holds a centennial celebration of the Copa America which will probably feature Dybala but not Messi as both Brazil and Argentina test their u23 squads prior to the Rio Olympics.
     
  6. ForzaWatford

    ForzaWatford Squad Player

    I'm going to see him play on Sunday, so I hope he wasn't out partying too much!
     
  7. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    Treasure the memory Forza. It will be a long while before anyone comes to close to him. He's fairly introverted so I doubt he would have partied that much. Safe journey there and back and enjoy the experience. I'm sure you will. :)

    [video=youtube;q-3HrqDXpUE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-3HrqDXpUE[/video]
     
  8. hornetgags

    hornetgags McMuff's lovechild

    Messi has a big nose...I have to find some fault with him.
     
  9. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    Well he is a man-dog......;)

    [video=youtube;Wsf7RQpiij0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wsf7RQpiij0[/video]
     
  10. reids

    reids First Team

    https://streamable.com/d2dy

    Keep your eyes on Messi. He points at Suarez for Turan to pass to, knowing exactly what'll happen, all before it does. That's why he's the best.
     
  11. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    [video=youtube;j9u1Uj5CPmg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9u1Uj5CPmg[/video]
     
  12. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    Watched this recently. Contains some clips I had never seen. Luke may be interested. ;)

    [video=youtube;w21dkqtBwXk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w21dkqtBwXk[/video]
     
  13. With A Smile

    With A Smile First Team

    I went to Ossie Ardiles testimonial at Spurs and Maradona was playing for Spurs. During the warm up he was doing keepy uppies with two balls at a time, then with an orange and then hitting the ball 30 or 40 feet in the air and retuning it back to the same hight first hit with out it bouncing.

    Looking at that video it does make you think players go down far to easily nowerdays
     
  14. wfcSinatra

    wfcSinatra Predictor Choker 14/15

    Look at some of the tackles he had to ride.. bloody hell.
     
  15. zztop

    zztop Eurovision Winner 2015

    Simply brilliant. 18 minutes of clip of one player, any one of which would have been drooled over in isolation these days.

    As others have hinted at, it demonstrates what a load of pansies we have playing football these days, going down at the first bit of contact, and then referees booking the tackler.

    Half of those clips would have been ended at the first tackle around the halfway line.

    What a load of wimps!
     
  16. wfcSinatra

    wfcSinatra Predictor Choker 14/15

    Viva Ronaldo.
     
  17. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    A few piddling goals suddenly doesn't make Cristina the better player. He never was and never will be. Hopefully Atletico take the title.
     
  18. wfcSinatra

    wfcSinatra Predictor Choker 14/15

    Well we know who showed up when the occasion called for it! ;)
     
  19. Timbers

    Timbers Apeman

    Like in international football as well ;)

    It's fair to say that bar the last few weeks, Messi and Barca have been far, far, better.
     
  20. wfcSinatra

    wfcSinatra Predictor Choker 14/15

    He can't do everything:rolleye1:
     
  21. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    [video=youtube;VnfIld1jHfc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnfIld1jHfc[/video]

    [video=youtube;5afVn9N1e7o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5afVn9N1e7o[/video]
     
  22. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    [video=youtube;7acaZH9I8NU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7acaZH9I8NU[/video]​

    Another record passes to the little maestro.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2016
  23. Timbers

    Timbers Apeman

    He has scored 65 penalties and missed 19, excluding the penalty shoot-out. Fair to say two things he is not great at then, tax keeping and pens!

    Shame to see him retire but I am sure he will be back for the world cup in Russia, his last chance to win international silverware.
     
  24. The Whoosh Magnet

    The Whoosh Magnet Academy Graduate

    I don't think I've seen him play, is he any good?
     
  25. Otter

    Otter Gambling industry insider

  26. Otter

    Otter Gambling industry insider

    He may get in to the prison team.
     
  27. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Can serve it under probation under Spanish law though.
     
  28. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    Not going to actually serve it is he..

    TBF He won't be the only well know footballer/celeb with a few tax issues.

    They probably wanted to make an example of Messi.
     
  29. Meh!

    Meh! Pre-Dictator

    That sounds like the premise for a great film idea.
     
  30. The Whoosh Magnet

    The Whoosh Magnet Academy Graduate

    It would be too similar to Escape to Victory
     
  31. LondonOrn

    LondonOrn Squad Player

    If all this is true and his father is the one primarily responsible for managing his finances, then he should get the jail term, for longer than what Lionel has been given, and actually inside. To have dragged his own son into this much trouble is disgraceful.

    While it's true Messi can't be totally exonerated for not reading the documents, it's only human behaviour that he should trust his father to get it right and just sign on the dotted line. How many of us, let's be honest including those of us on here, just sign contracts/agreements without bothering to read any of the small print properly, if at all?
     
  32. Bahrain Hornet

    Bahrain Hornet Academy Graduate

    All sentences under 2 years are usually on a suspended sentence in Spain so I believe.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  33. Arakel

    Arakel First Team

    I have some sympathy for him if what he claims is true.

    I have an accountant who does all my filing for me, because I don't have the expertise to do it myself. If he does something wrong then I doubt I'd have the ability to spot it.

    It's a tricky situation when governments make tax filing so ****ing complicated and yet try to enforce harsh evasion penalties on people who have delegated it to others more suited for the task.
     
  34. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Hardly basic tax filing though Arakel. They were funnelling money via offshore banks in Belize and other favourable jurisdictions were they not? It's not like Messi senior just put the wrong figure in the box of a tax return!
     
  35. Arakel

    Arakel First Team

    That wasn't the point. The point is that people delegate this stuff in the first place precisely because it's so ridiculously complicated. The fact that Messi's case is a tangled web of head spinning financial slight of hand only proves that.

    Assuming you believe him when he says he knew nothing (and there's no evidence to the contrary), he's guilty of nothing more than poor judgement. Messi Sr. is another matter.
     

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