History & Archaeology Thread

Discussion in 'Taylor's Tittle-Tattle - General Banter' started by StuBoy, Sep 22, 2020.

  1. Since63

    Since63 Reservist

    There is no doubt that the IDEA of the Empire was a major feature of all political theory & often practice during the early medieval period. The coronation of Charlemagne as Holy Roman Emperor was not viewed as a new development, but a return to the natural order of the ‘golden age’. The increased influence of the Church was also paralleled in the Eastern Empire.
     
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  2. Mazzereth

    Mazzereth Academy Graduate

    I got back into Roman History again recently following a trip to Pompeii last January, after a period of getting 'bored' with it.

    Two good entry level books about the Roman Empire are Rubicon and Dynasty, both by Tom Holland. They cover the fall of the Republic and the Julio-Claudian dynasty. There are names and incidents in these books that the most casual fan of history will recognise and ease them in to further exploration.

    For those that like a bit of historical fiction, I suggest The Cicero Trilogy by Robert Harris.

    FYI, favourite Roman imperial name, 'Diocletian'.
     
  3. Since63

    Since63 Reservist

    Palace fan, mate, so it’s a ‘no’ from me. Pertinax one of my favourites.
     
  4. Sahorn

    Sahorn Reservist

    Eats, shoots and leaves.
    Eats shoots and leaves.
    Which is the cowboy, and which is the panda?
    How the use of a comma, or not, can really **** up the meaning.
     
  5. Sahorn

    Sahorn Reservist

    The first educational lesson must surely be the use of ‘lose’ and ‘loose’.
    I cannot understand how the Hornets loose so many games on this forum.
     
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  6. Sahorn

    Sahorn Reservist

    For the uninitiated like myself who has not read one of these great tomes being mentioned, I can recommend the History Channel series ‘Barbarians Rising’.
    An entertaining snapshot of the history of the Roman Empire through the eyes of outsider ‘barbarians’.
     
  7. Sahorn

    Sahorn Reservist

    And what about the success of the economy of the Roman Empire by enslavement?

    Dependant on a very high proportion of slaves to Roman Citizens in their populace, there should now be a full rewriting of history with statues of Emperors destroyed or cast into the deep and place names changed, because they all condoned and encouraged slavery.

    The whole Roman Empire would have collapsed without slaves.

    I believe there should now be full compensation paid (especially to me) on a quantum meruit basis from these dastardly Roman people.
     
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  8. El distraído

    El distraído Johnny Foreigner

    I concur!

    Let's eat, grandma!
    Let's eat grandma!
     
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  9. Davy Crockett

    Davy Crockett Reservist

    Do you know what ?
    I have never given thought to the importance of maths before your post
    Maybe the answers to many fall of the Roman empire there ?
     
  10. Davy Crockett

    Davy Crockett Reservist

    You are a lose cannon mate
     
  11. StuBoy

    StuBoy Forum Cad and Bounder

    Yeah, @Since63 makes a great point and one I hadn’t really considered before either. So many reasons why the Empire fell, but this is an interesting one.
     
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  12. Sahorn

    Sahorn Reservist

    Not me - straight as a die conformist, me.

    Although I did discover my mate's girlfriend was very lose, but he never believed me :rolleyes:
     
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  13. Aberystwyth_Hornet

    Aberystwyth_Hornet Squad Player

    Have you read "Fate of Rome"? Not had a chance yet but apparently very good
     
  14. Since63

    Since63 Reservist

    I think discussion of that book led to this thread being migrated from whatever foottwatt3ry thread it started on...
     
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  15. GarethCritic

    GarethCritic Academy Graduate

    I thought it was lead poisoning. And the reliance on slaves...
     
  16. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    As Since63 said it was started in the Vladimir Ivic thread. Well worth a read. Usual causes for an empire to fail are explored involving disease and climate change. Get your copy quick if you want the hardback. The prices of these once they go out of print sky rocket.

    The Romans did not innovate that much. They borrowed a lot and adapted from arches to clibinarii. If they found something useful they would adopt it. Pozzolana is an amazing material. When you look at the concrete cancer of many modern buildings while those the Roman's constructed still look magnificent. Constructing the port at Ostia under Narcissus for instance. These types of concrete after sufficient curing were incredibly strong and durable although still vulnerable to freeze-thaw something given the location of these deposits in the Mediterranean was not tested at the time.
     
  17. I Blame Bassett

    I Blame Bassett Squad Player

    I've just discovered this thread and enjoy such matters.
    I'm half way through Suetonius and 'The Twelve Caesars'.
    Tom Holland is always good value and his translation of Herodotus is excellent,not that I've read the original,although I'm getting better!
    Mary Beard was very helpful with her insight for my tutoring project and has given me good ideas on text books.
    Good thread!
     
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  18. Bwood_Horn

    Bwood_Horn Squad Player

    One of my acquaintances (and all of their acquaintances) makes of point of dropping into conversation with her at college functions just how much they enjoy reading and re-reading Daniel P. Mannix's book...
     
  19. Aberystwyth_Hornet

    Aberystwyth_Hornet Squad Player

    I got it for my uncle last year, had been meaning to get it for myself for a while so thanks for the push - copy from Ebay in new condition on the way!

    Sure everyone reading this thread has read it but the Lives of the 12 Caesars is fascinating - edit see it's already been mentioned :)

    Studied Celtic and Roman archaeology in my final year. A long time ago now but have kept all my books about it. Loads of hidden roman remains in London if you know where to look in the city
     
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  20. El distraído

    El distraído Johnny Foreigner

  21. StuBoy

    StuBoy Forum Cad and Bounder

  22. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    He goes into minute details including the Nile inundations (Chapter 4), the ENSO and the effect of poor crop yields from the bread basket of the Empire coupled with paying huge sums of money to buy off the Sassanid Persians. It is a fascinating book. And prescient.

    All this has happened before and will happen again will no doubt be familiar to @Arakel @Bwood_Horn but they too thought the world was still running smoothly on it's axis almost until the climactic end. Much as most are now blithely carrying on without thinking that every minute huge destruction and damage to the planet is occurring.
     
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  23. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    When I was a small child I was taken to London by my father to the Tower of London but one of the first places I remember stopping at was looking at this old wall. I remember vividly looking at it and being amazed as a small child at how old it was as related by my dad. It left a profound impression on me and triggered a deep interest in history from that point on. Just the sight of this magnificent facade and how it has affected London ever since for instance in it's modern layout.
     
  24. StuBoy

    StuBoy Forum Cad and Bounder

    Finished reading this over Christmas along with Augustus by Adrian Goldsworthy, both very good books and as you say @Smudger very prescient considering our current circumstances Fate of Rome was. A fascinating read. I was pleasantly surprised the wife brought me Suetonius the Twelve Caesars for Christmas, which I shall move onto next.
     
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  25. I Blame Bassett

    I Blame Bassett Squad Player

    Suet,as Ford and Arthur call him is entertaining,although I haven't finished him as have jumped onto "The Secret Code" about Divine Proportion.
     
  26. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    It is International Book Day. How lucky we are that the printed word is so freely available and such a wealth of knowledge to teach skills, formulate ideas and enrich the experience of life exist.

    I have just bought this:
    Imperial Tragedy: From Constantine’s Empire to the Destruction of Roman Italy AD 363-568

    Still to read it but focuses on the destructive campaigns of Julian instead of consolidating to the loss of Italy as a province after the campaigns of Belisariusand the end of the reign of Justinian.

    The English Civil War: An Atlas and Concise History of the Wars of the Three Kingdoms 1639–51

    Another recent purchase. Prices of this are going up quickly so if you are interested in this period of history in the isles this is a must. Beautifully illustrated although the battle dispositions could be clearer and with detailed explanations of each sides motivations, organization and tactics and seminal moments such as the seizure of Bristol by the Royalists being the second city of the realm at the time. Smaller skirmishes are also covered and possible locations discussed based on recent archaelogical work.

    Pompeii has yielded a fabulously preserved ceremonial chariot.
    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smar...ue-ceremonial-vehicle-near-pompeii-180977117/

    Much of the site of Pompeii and Herculaneum still awaits decades of excavation. As does Akrotiri a modern looking well planned settlement buried by the huge explosion at Santorini.
     
  27. StuBoy

    StuBoy Forum Cad and Bounder

    Wow those look like good book recommendations! That chariot was something else at Pompeii too.

    I have a backlog of books at the moment (not all Roman related too I might add!). So I'll need to make some progress on these before I buy some more!
     
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  28. BigRossLittleRoss

    BigRossLittleRoss First Team

    Can’t read books anymore , ever since my A levels really . So am an avid history podcast listener .

    Mike Duncan’s one on History of Rome is exceptional .

    I’ve also been nodding off to In Our Time and have finally got through the entire back catalogue of hundreds .

    Fortunately I missed most of them due to being sleep so am now undertaking a second sweep .
     
  29. BigRossLittleRoss

    BigRossLittleRoss First Team

    The reasons why Empires begin and end is completely analogous to the reason why species of animals prosper , thrive and then die . The rules of evolution .

    The rules of evolution apply on the micro level to individual species and on a macro level to groups of humans .

    Sure , historians will debate the specific reasons as to why any civilisation rises and falls , but the overall defining macro reason is the same as defines the success of individual species ie survival of the fittest etc .
     
  30. El distraído

    El distraído Johnny Foreigner

  31. El distraído

    El distraído Johnny Foreigner

    Also I know this isn't a grammar thread, but I took this apostrophe quiz on the BBC just now and to my horror, only got 9/10.

    I'm sure the quix will be of interest to some in this thread haha.
     
  32. WillisWasTheWorst

    WillisWasTheWorst Its making less grammar mistake's thats important

    I bet you got the same one wrong as me: the special rule for biblical and classical characters. Nonsense.
     
  33. StuBoy

    StuBoy Forum Cad and Bounder

    Yes I have, it is good, but like you not something I could just pick up and read. Had to keep putting it down for a while before picking it up again. I like Mary Beard, but didn't find this book to be 'easy reading' personally.
     
  34. Bwood_Horn

    Bwood_Horn Squad Player

    TBF I *think* this was her attempt at a pop-history (cf A Brief History of Time) and it fails on soooooo many levels.
     
  35. I Blame Bassett

    I Blame Bassett Squad Player

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