2022 - 2023 Squad

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by EB Hornet, Jun 22, 2022.

  1. Jon G

    Jon G Academy Graduate

    I used two extremes - Salah as arguably the best footballer in the world and me as unarguably the worst, and asked where, on the scale between the two, the original poster defined “not very good”. Common sense says it is somewhere - but where? Assume I have no common sense (if I did, I wouldn’t be spending time on a football fans forum ).
     
  2. Jon G

    Jon G Academy Graduate

    Selective - I included playing for Manchester Utd and winning the Premier League as well.
    And “hectoring” means lecturing forcefully, but I was asking a question. Although my explanation of “hectoring” could be seen as such, I grant you.
    I find it amusing that when someone asks for clarity of a bald assertion, the questioner is accused of hectoring, not the asserter.
     
  3. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    In my view hectoring is the perfect description of how you post over an extended sample. While I go along with the joke ,I don't personally think you are one of those unpleasant smug sycophants from FTRE. That said you certainly carry yourself in the same way they do.
     
    CarlosKickaballs likes this.
  4. simpleMASH

    simpleMASH Reservist

    If we’re moving to 5-2-3 as our last two friendlies suggest (though I still think that will be shelved once ED+IS are sold in a few weeks) then I think we’re already overstocked in midfield. A better player would be great, but our scouting department are useless. Cheaper to use the dross we already have.

    If Samir is off though, we desperately need a replacement there. I think we arguably already needed a better ball-player on the right, so maybe need 2 CBs now.

    Pollock’s not been anywhere near the pre-season lineups lately, perhaps find him a loan to keep us at 6 players for the 3 places.
     
  5. Jon G

    Jon G Academy Graduate

    In my view it isn’t. So we can leave it at that. Not sure what you mean by “carry yourself”. My posture isn’t great, admittedly, but not sure how you’d know that.
     
  6. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    If you Google the phrase you can actually find out.
     
    CarlosKickaballs likes this.
  7. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    So, all the pre-season games are now over. We've seen a finalising of formation and we can read between the lines on players that are in Edwards' thoughts.

    It now seems clear Bachmann is the number one. I think that shows we've probably wasted £5m on the purchase of Okoye, as if he cannot displace Bachmann, that's really not a good sign.

    Even without Kiko, Watford still feel it better to switch Kamara to the right rather than play Ngakia. I really think it's time he's either sold or loaned out this season. He's not going to get much game time as a right wingback.

    Samir appears to be on his way out, which will be another loss to us. The only left sided CB we have. Will we try to replace him, or try and muddle through with what we have? My guess is it will be the latter. Sierralta looked commanding again and makes you wonder why he was so underused last season. I feel he's going to be vital to us, especially if we have Bachmann as the number one. During the last Championship season, Sierralta got his head to everything, which covered Bachmann's weakness on crosses. It's important that continues again this season.

    The midfield is short on quality, but we do have many players. This is a problem really, as we have too many backup and so few first choice players here. Having said that, I think Kayembe maybe a bit of a surprise. I liked what I saw of him today. It looks as though Quina is going to be surplus to requirements, as he was an unused substitute yet again.

    Up front we're in trouble if Sarr and Dennis go. From what I've seen of Bayo and Manaj, they are as I first thought, just backup players. If they become first team starters, we're not going up this season....that's for sure.

    I liked what I saw from Sema today, as I had him down as a player we'd probably ship out. But he did more than enough to suggest he's going to be useful to us. A very able backup to Kamara on the left.

    The right wingback side is now a problem. As mentioned, Ngakia can't get in and Hungbo wasn't used as an experiment either. So we really do need to sign someone. I know we've got Gaspar, but I just don't think he'd be used as a right wingback (only in an emergency). I believe he's coming in as a right sided centre back, or at least I hope he is.

    So the shopping list is growing. We need real quality at right wingback. Not a make do, or an ok player. This position is fundamental to making Edwards' system work. We need quality here. A young player, who has bags of energy with technical ability and pace.

    We need a box-to-box midfielder. Someone who can really dominate a match. We need a natural left sided CB (if Samir goes). We need real quality to replace Sarr and/or Dennis if they go.

    If we got all that. we'd be a strong side. We could probably get away with not signing a CB, but the RWB and midfielder is vital, as would be a high level forward if Sarr or Dennis go.
     
  8. luke_golden

    luke_golden Space Cadet

    Is the ant vaccination science very strong? In my experience, it’s based on a small sample size, and at the end of the day, producing tiny needles capable of vaccinating ants seems like a misuse of resources. That’s without even getting into the ethical debate surrounding the use of human medicine on ants. Either way, it’s noble of you to take on the ant vaccine lobby. Respect.
     
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  9. Jon G

    Jon G Academy Graduate

    Ah, a “do your own research into what I meant” reply.
    I did Google it. The definition I found is “To walk or move in a certain physical manner”. I’m afraid I still don’t understand what you meant.
     
  10. Jon G

    Jon G Academy Graduate

    Thank you. Insects deserve protecting too.
     
  11. Cassetti's Beard

    Cassetti's Beard First Team

    I thought podders didn't interact with us mere mortals? Isn't it rule number 2 of the poddy charter?

    Current squad will finish 1st easily.
     
  12. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    This reply perfectly encapsulates why people are loath to engage with you when you frame something as a 'genuine question'....

    Theres an undercurrent of smugness in your replies that make it obvious that you already had the answer you wanted in your mind. That's what Jumbo meant about the way you 'carry yourself' - yet here we go with you being sarky and pretending you didn't know what he meant.

    There's no way that you aren't aware of the tone your posts are read with most of the time - pleading ignorance just looks a bit foolish really.
     
  13. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    It seems bizarre if we really are signing Gaspar to be the RWB as it's using up yet another non-HG spot.

    The team we put out yesterday was already maxed out on 11 non-HG players (assuming Hamer will be on the bench in the league instead of Okoye).

    So bringing in Gaspar would likely mean one of Kabs, Asprilla or Sema can't even make the matchday squad. There'd remain no room for Samir either so have to assume he's gone.

    Plus, this is all before Louza comes back. Kayembe has been our best performing CM in pre-season, but for a Louza and Kayembe partnership we'd have to have two out of Kabs, Asprilla, Sema, Manaj and Bayo not in the matchday squad.

    This is also assuming Sarr is being sold, as with him one of the remaining of Manaj, Asprilla or Bayo would also have to be pushed out.
     
    hornetfan likes this.
  14. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    First hit in bold when you search right at top:

    “To behave, especially with respect to how one’s speech conveys one’s opinion concerning oneself”

    synonyms: behave, act, conduct oneself

    In summary when I read your posts, I hear the sneering self indulgent smugness of the FTRE guys.
     
    CarlosKickaballs likes this.
  15. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    Some speculating about whether the likes of Ngakia, Quina and Hungbo go on loan - unless we bring in additional HG players in key positions then some of them will simply have to stay in order to fill up the bench and provide cover in an absolute emergency, given our lack of other HG options.

    They might not even get minutes, but it's a way in which the 'rule of 11' can backfire on its intended aim - as it forces clubs to keep HG players simply to fill up the bench even if they don't really get played, as opposed to being able to send them on loan where they might actually get regular minutes.
     
  16. WalthamstowHornet

    WalthamstowHornet Academy Graduate

    Agreed - the 11 non-HG rule is really quite restrictive in our position. All the stranger that since mentioning it we have made absolutely zero attempt to do anything about it.
     
  17. Jon G

    Jon G Academy Graduate

    Fair enough. When I first joined up here I posted a couple of genuine reflections of how I saw things. I was looking forward to chatting with other Hornets, the way you do down the pub.
    But down the pub one’s views are listened to and treated with respect, leading to genuine discourse. On here I was summarily dismissed, with high-handed assertions.
    I was associated with a podcast which I listen to but with which I am not involved. The people on that pod seem pretty nice guys, enthusiastic about Watford and I was somewhat shocked at the vitriol thrown at them on here, seemingly just because they see things differently from certain forum members. The attitude towards me, and them, appeared unexpectedly and unnecessarily hostile and aggressive.
    The longer I spent on the forum the more I realised that it wasn’t just aimed at me or them, it was directed at pretty much everyone - the owners, the management, the coach, the players, a large proportion of the fan base, most of the enthusiastic podcasters, half the forum members…. It is generally more toxic than I expected from a place where one comes to talk about a leisure pursuit that is supposed to provide one with pleasure (and 50 years as a supporter has given me significantly more pleasure than hurt).
    So I decided to stop trying to chat about Watford (happily there are other places to do that, not least the pub) and start questioning and analysing the high handed assertions being chucked about. To date very few have been able to explain their statements, instead get worked up about my questions and my inferred attitude. Entirely their prerogative, but not a great way to change minds. It’s been entertaining, though.
     
  18. Pozzo Out

    Pozzo Out Squad Player

    Shush.
     
  19. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    I agree with you on one thing. There are multiple people accountable for the state of our club. The owners and the players, and to a lesser extent the sychophantic podcasters and about half our enabling odd fanbase.

    If you want to know what I mean by “state of our club” you don’t need to listen to me. You just need to read the accounts, consider the extent of our relationship with Bayat and listen to Dan Gosling, rather than listen to propaganda from Scott Duxbury.

    Until Pozzo and his henchmen are gone (or completely change their ways) I will continue to be hostile (aka disagree with) the owners and their defenders and I make no apology for that.
     
  20. EB Hornet

    EB Hornet Reservist

    Keep posting about Watford and ignore any childish replies. If you sift through the 10 forum ‘jokes’ that get repeated every other post and ignore any personal attacks, it’s not that bad a place to be and chat about the club, the team and the games. You’re going to be known as podcast Jon by a few from here on, so ignore it or even go along with it for the #bantz.
     
    hjw likes this.
  21. hjw

    hjw Reservist

    A great post, they sums up a lot of what I think. A great tip is to make extensive use of the "ignore" function, which is basically a banned list. It makes this forum a much better experience
     
  22. The Voice of Reason

    The Voice of Reason First Team Captain

    Tell me about it mate, I have had to put up with it for years. Of late I have just put many of the usual subjects on my ignore list, they just ain't worth arguing with :rolleyes:
     
    The girl in row H likes this.
  23. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    I’d stick you on ignore as well but wouldn’t want to miss out on such gems as “Get behind the team you purport to support” or your musing about African players being worried about voodoo curses.
     
    CarlosKickaballs, Chewitt and RS2 like this.
  24. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Trying to predict what the club are going to do in the final weeks of the window.

    Currently we have 10 home grown players on the books. For me that's a bit light as we have to have 7 HG players for every matchday squad. What if we get 4 injuries all at once. Cleverley, Cathcart, Gosling could easily be injured often. It really takes us down to the wire and quickly.

    It doesn't look like we're going to use Ngakia or Quina, but may have to retain them against our wishes and against the player's best interest. What happens if we cannot fulfil a 7 HG quota for any given match? Does anyone know what the punishment would be for that?

    We really do need to be signing HG players from here on in. I think we will sign a left-sided HG CB. So, that will give us 11 HG players and I think Pedro becomes a HG player in September, or something like that.

    I should imagine we'll be signing a RWB who will be HG, so we could be boosted to 13 HG players.

    On the NHG player issue, we need to get this number down to 11. With Samir and Kiko going, but Gaspar signing, that adjusts the NHG total down to 13. With the exclusion of Kalu on Saturday, that must surely mean he's out the door. A totally ridiculous, unnecessary signing and a waste of £3m. Well done Giaretta for another blooper to add to his every expanding list of f$ck ups. So if Kalu goes that number is down to 12, but with Louza not available to play initially, the club might feel that is ok to go with 12.

    I think Baah will be loaned out too, even though he's U21, so not part of the NHG list of players. His exclusion from Saturday suggests he's not required either.

    Who else will be culled? Dahlberg and Angelini should be loaned out.

    My final squad prediction:-
    HG
    Bachmann, Hamer, Cathcart, Cleverley, Gosling, WTE, TDB, Hungbo, Ngakia, Quina, new RWB, new left-sided CB - 12 (Pedro added in Sept?)
    NHG
    Okoye, Gaspar, Sierralta, Kabasele, Kamara, Louza, Kayembe, Dennis, Sarr, Sema, Bayo, Manaj - 12

    Personally, I'd also like to see a HG high level box-to-box midfielder signed, but I don't see that happening, unless we can get someone on loan. Maybe use that supposed Arsenal friendship?
     
  25. ThePaperBoy

    ThePaperBoy No Longer Delivering

    I'm not nitpicking HB1, but a couple of minor points;

    He qualifies in January as homegrown.

    Baah qualifies as homegrown despite being born in Germany as he was at the Crystal Palace academy for 4 years.
     
    hornetboy1 likes this.
  26. EB Hornet

    EB Hornet Reservist

    Updated with RWB Spanish Switcheroo. Also have moved Angelini and Mebude to the ‘extras’ section as likely U’21 team.

    Non-Home Grown (Rule of Eleven) (currently 17) Home Grown (currently 14) Total - 31

    Maduka Okoye GK
    Pontus Dahlberg GK

    Daniel Bachmann GK
    Ben Hamer GK

    Mario Gaspar RWB
    Jeremy Ngakia RWB
    Joseph Hungbo RWB

    Hassane Kamara LWB
    Ken Sema LWB

    James Morris LWB

    Cristian Kabasele CB

    Francisco Sierralta CB
    Samir CB
    Craig Cathcart CB
    William Troost-Ekong CB
    Mattie Pollock CB

    Edo Kayembe MF
    Imran Louza MF
    Yaser Asprilla MF
    Tom Dele-Bashiru MF
    Dan Gosling MF
    Tom Cleverley MF
    Domingos Quina MF

    Vakoun Bayo FW
    Rey Manaj FW
    Emmanuel Dennis FW
    Joao Pedro FW
    Samuel Kalu FW
    Ismaila Sarr FW

    Kwadwo Baah FW
    Ashley Fletcher FW

    Possible Extras / Unknowns

    Pussetto
    Penaranda
    Angelini
    Mebude

    Manning
    Rose
    Andrews
    Forde
    Holding
    Mckiernan
    Adeyemo
    Blake
     
  27. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    Duxbury again referring to, as he puts it, 'the so called Rule of Eleven'. No-one else calls it that, it's a phrase Watford seem to have made up.

    If we set aside Sissoko who was always going to leave, we haven't made any inroads into it at all for the players you'd think could've been in this season's squad.

    In (from what we had last season): Bayo, Gaspar, Manaj, Asprilla,Okoye

    Out: Cucho, Zinckernagel, Masina, Femenia, Samir (soon)

    So after knowing we were going to be relegated before the season ended, we've not actually adjusted the squad at all in terms of this all important rule and we're just about to kick off the new season.
     
    wfcmoog, simpleMASH, RS2 and 3 others like this.
  28. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    Yes seems to have been a bit of an excuse to sell players (or say Edwards didn’t want them )

    With the exception of Kiko who the club did say wanted to go for personal reasons.
     
    Jumbolina likes this.
  29. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    I truly feel sorry for people who believe anything Duxbury says.
     
    wfcmoog likes this.
  30. simpleMASH

    simpleMASH Reservist

    Why have we not announced squad numbers yet?
     
    TomWatfordFC likes this.
  31. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    We can't decide which one of our ace new strikers should be number 9.
     
  32. simpleMASH

    simpleMASH Reservist

    I thought it was inconceivable to fit another midfielder into our squad, but after yesterday I now agree with the majority that we’ll be right in the s*** if we don’t.

    If I were playing FM/FIFA, the transfers I’d look to make are:

    Out
    Rose, Fletcher, Peñaranda, Pussetto, Samir, Quina, Dahlberg (loan), Pollock (loan), Angelini (loan), Mebude (loan)

    In (all homegrown):
    Laird, LCB (Clarke?), CM (Azeez? Morton? No idea if they’re good enough yet. Choudhury? Delph? - Not all serious suggestions).

    And then if Dennis/Sarr go, we need a proper finisher in the team. But with Archer and Armstrong apparently staying at Villa and Southampton, respectively, that might be tricky. Even Balogun - who many turned their noses up at - is off on loan to Reims in Ligue Un.
    Could we afford a fee? If Brereton Diaz, Semenyo or Adebayo were available for ~£10m then we’d still be able to pay off some debts while adding a striker we could fee confident would score.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2022
  33. Heidar

    Heidar Squad Player

    Assuming Laird and Samir replacement, it does feel like we're one midfielder away from an excellent first XI.

    But as with all of our sides, we tend to leave our little hole in the Death Star. Usually at Left Back but we have more than we need for once.

    Perhaps worth waiting until the PL sides have their 25 and pick off what is left on loan. Dare I say Brentford look a little overstocked in that department.
     
    wimbornet and simpleMASH like this.
  34. simpleMASH

    simpleMASH Reservist

    Good shout. Dasilva, Onyeka, Jensen, Janelt, Norgaard. Now potentially Damsgaard to compete for the #10 role which might make one of those redundant. I think they’d all improve our midfield if that was a possibility.
     
  35. Heidar

    Heidar Squad Player

    Indeed. Though I was thinking Shandon Baptiste haha
     

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