View Poll Results: Who would you vote for if the election was now?

Voters
75. You may not vote on this poll
  • Labour

    17 22.67%
  • Conservative

    25 33.33%
  • LibDem

    24 32.00%
  • UKIP

    2 2.67%
  • Independent

    1 1.33%
  • Green

    3 4.00%
  • Other Party

    3 4.00%
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Thread: WFC Forums General Election Poll

  1. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of Barry Endean View Post
    What's your view on Christianity, Kelso? Do you know that the only self 'confessed' atheist to lead a political party in recent years was Nick Clegg? This witch hunt against Farron is absurd. He has an almost exemplary record on gay rights. In fact, even though I find his religion questionable and his born-again-ness risible, the fact that he does not allow either to colour his actions in office totally commendable.

    In fact, a little more 'Christianity' wouldn't go amiss amongst the austerity pumping Tories you profess to admire.
    But I'm not the one that's been banging on about prejudices am I? Therefore, it seems to me that it's your lot that's got the problem ...
    Last edited by KelsoOrn; Today at 07:05 AM.

  2. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of Barry Endean View Post
    What's your view on Christianity, Kelso? Do you know that the only self 'confessed' atheist to lead a political party in recent years was Nick Clegg? This witch hunt against Farron is absurd. He has an almost exemplary record on gay rights. In fact, even thyough I find his religion questionable and his born-again-ness risible, the fact that he does not allow either to colour his actions in office totally commendable.

    In fact, a little more 'Christianity' wouldn't go amiss amongst the austerity pumping Tories you profess to admire.
    But he doesn't do anything other than talk. Yet, by his own admission, this homophobia charge has become an issue even though it shouldn't have. By avoiding clear answering, he has cocked it up.

    That isn't commendable at all.

  3. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by zztop View Post
    But he doesn't do anything other than talk. Yet, by his own admission, this homophobia charge has become an issue even though it shouldn't have. By avoiding clear answering, he has cocked it up.

    That isn't commendable at all.
    Well, he's not in power is he. But from the previously linked Huffington article which you obviously didn't bother with:

    So lets do a little list of things which illustrate how Tim Farron views LGBT people:
    1. With one exception, Tim Farron voted fully in favour of same sex marriage. The one time he abstained? That was because he was trying to get an amendment passed on the Spousal Veto, a really nasty little clause which shafts trans people. Yep, thatís right, even the time he abstained was because he was fighting for LGBT+ rights, not against them.
    2. He was the first party leader to issue a statement on the gay concentration camps in Chechnya. He condemned them in the strongest terms. And while the Greens have since joined in, none of the Tories, Labour, or UKIP have.
    3. He campaigned against section 28 from its inception, and thinks that refusing people service for their sexuality (like bakeries not baking cakes for gay marriages) is un-Christian.
    4. He spoke out on the blood donation ban (Iím still banned from giving blood, by the way - because I have had sexual relations with bisexual men).
    5. He has campaigned tirelessly for the rights of trans women in prisons, and trans issues in general. When we had a trans rights motion before conference, he was there at 9.30am in the front row to vote for it. Not because of the cameras - there were no cameras - but because he is enthusiastic about LGBT+ rights, and not just G rights with a smattering of L like many politicians.
    6. When Lib Dem conference brought in an accreditation scheme that inadvertently discriminated against LGBT+ people, he listened to us at LGBT+LDs, and then he went to head office and batted for us till the scheme was changed, and eventually dropped.
    Now I may be an idiot, but there is one thing I am not, Sir, and that, Sir, is an idiot.

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  5. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of Barry Endean View Post
    Well, he's not in power is he. But from the previously linked Huffington article which you obviously didn't bother with:

    So lets do a little list of things which illustrate how Tim Farron views LGBT people:
    1. With one exception, Tim Farron voted fully in favour of same sex marriage. The one time he abstained? That was because he was trying to get an amendment passed on the Spousal Veto, a really nasty little clause which shafts trans people. Yep, thatís right, even the time he abstained was because he was fighting for LGBT+ rights, not against them.
    2. He was the first party leader to issue a statement on the gay concentration camps in Chechnya. He condemned them in the strongest terms. And while the Greens have since joined in, none of the Tories, Labour, or UKIP have.
    3. He campaigned against section 28 from its inception, and thinks that refusing people service for their sexuality (like bakeries not baking cakes for gay marriages) is un-Christian.
    4. He spoke out on the blood donation ban (Iím still banned from giving blood, by the way - because I have had sexual relations with bisexual men).
    5. He has campaigned tirelessly for the rights of trans women in prisons, and trans issues in general. When we had a trans rights motion before conference, he was there at 9.30am in the front row to vote for it. Not because of the cameras - there were no cameras - but because he is enthusiastic about LGBT+ rights, and not just G rights with a smattering of L like many politicians.
    6. When Lib Dem conference brought in an accreditation scheme that inadvertently discriminated against LGBT+ people, he listened to us at LGBT+LDs, and then he went to head office and batted for us till the scheme was changed, and eventually dropped.
    He also was caught flat footed at QT yesterday clearly not knowing about his candidate in Bradford East having been accused of anti-semitism. What did he do? That afternoon he suspended him, dropped him as a candidate and there will be a Party investigation. Another liberal and anti intolerant action.

  6. #165
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    This election is a difficult call for me.

    I don't agree with many Tory policies and think many of their politicians are loathsome.

    But for me the worse possible result would be the status quo where the extreme right of the Tory party have an undue influence on government policy.

    So for me the best outcome would be either a massive Tory majority or some kind of coalition. Either, in my view, would reduce the influence of the Tory extreme right and, hopefully, moderate government policy.

    I think May is a chameleon politician. I don't think she is naturally on the far right of the Tories but is just protecting her fragile position as leader by reflecting the views of the current biggest influence in the party. If she has a bigger majority I suspect she will eject some of those far right influences from her inner circle and move more to the middle. That's my hope anyway!

    I would like to see an increase in the Liberal vote as it could influence the government's​ Brexit stance.

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  8. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by sydney_horn View Post
    I think May is a chameleon politician. I don't think she is naturally on the far right of the Tories but is just protecting her fragile position as leader by reflecting the views of the current biggest influence in the party. If she has a bigger majority I suspect she will eject some of those far right influences from her inner circle and move more to the middle. That's my hope anyway!
    I see her completely differently, I think she's a genuine right wing conservative when it comes to most social issues. She's almost always voted against equality measures, is strongly anti-immigration (and accepting refugees), has no interest in environmental protection, is anti-Human Rights legislation, supports grammar schools, relies on her Christian faith to steer her policy making. She's the most socially conservative Prime Minister we've had for decades and her world view here fits with all the cranks and nutbags who are the furthest to the right of her party. They're all Brexiters, of course, which makes it very doubtful that she really favoured Remain at all, as does the zeal with which she's embraced a hard Brexit.

    However, she does also clash with the right of her party as she favours some state interference in markets (e.g. energy price caps, shamelessly stolen from Ed Miliband and then re-packaged), is likely to raise taxes and she's also authoritarian, backing sweeping state powers of surveillance.

    Either way, I can't stand her. She's completely opposed to any scrutiny, as evidenced by her behaviour surrounding Brexit, her refusal to do TV debates or to answer questions in PMQs, her refusal to take any questions from journalists at election events.

  9. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Leo Beleck View Post
    I see her completely differently, I think she's a genuine right wing conservative when it comes to most social issues. She's almost always voted against equality measures, is strongly anti-immigration (and accepting refugees), has no interest in environmental protection, is anti-Human Rights legislation, supports grammar schools, relies on her Christian faith to steer her policy making. She's the most socially conservative Prime Minister we've had for decades and her world view here fits with all the cranks and nutbags who are the furthest to the right of her party. They're all Brexiters, of course, which makes it very doubtful that she really favoured Remain at all, as does the zeal with which she's embraced a hard Brexit.

    However, she does also clash with the right of her party as she favours some state interference in markets (e.g. energy price caps, shamelessly stolen from Ed Miliband and then re-packaged), is likely to raise taxes and she's also authoritarian, backing sweeping state powers of surveillance.

    Either way, I can't stand her. She's completely opposed to any scrutiny, as evidenced by her behaviour surrounding Brexit, her refusal to do TV debates or to answer questions in PMQs, her refusal to take any questions from journalists at election events.
    The most interesting thing about Theresa May is many people have some very different opinions of what she's like, and what she stands for.

    Fits in well with her description of a charmeleon.

    For what it's worth, I think she's a social justice conservative. Socially right, and economically left. The wrong way round, personally.
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  10. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of Barry Endean View Post
    Well, he's not in power is he. But from the previously linked Huffington article which you obviously didn't bother with:

    So lets do a little list of things which illustrate how Tim Farron views LGBT people:
    1. With one exception, Tim Farron voted fully in favour of same sex marriage. The one time he abstained? That was because he was trying to get an amendment passed on the Spousal Veto, a really nasty little clause which shafts trans people. Yep, thatís right, even the time he abstained was because he was fighting for LGBT+ rights, not against them.
    2. He was the first party leader to issue a statement on the gay concentration camps in Chechnya. He condemned them in the strongest terms. And while the Greens have since joined in, none of the Tories, Labour, or UKIP have.
    3. He campaigned against section 28 from its inception, and thinks that refusing people service for their sexuality (like bakeries not baking cakes for gay marriages) is un-Christian.
    4. He spoke out on the blood donation ban (Iím still banned from giving blood, by the way - because I have had sexual relations with bisexual men).
    5. He has campaigned tirelessly for the rights of trans women in prisons, and trans issues in general. When we had a trans rights motion before conference, he was there at 9.30am in the front row to vote for it. Not because of the cameras - there were no cameras - but because he is enthusiastic about LGBT+ rights, and not just G rights with a smattering of L like many politicians.
    6. When Lib Dem conference brought in an accreditation scheme that inadvertently discriminated against LGBT+ people, he listened to us at LGBT+LDs, and then he went to head office and batted for us till the scheme was changed, and eventually dropped.
    Trans rights really do seem to be the flavour of the moment, something I think we have inherited from an American trend.
    They make up something like 0.01% of the population.
    I am not saying it isn't important, but the way it is reported and spoken about online just seems way out of proportion.

  11. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of Barry Endean View Post
    Well, he's not in power is he. But from the previously linked Huffington article which you obviously didn't bother with:

    So lets do a little list of things which illustrate how Tim Farron views LGBT people:
    1. With one exception, Tim Farron voted fully in favour of same sex marriage. The one time he abstained? That was because he was trying to get an amendment passed on the Spousal Veto, a really nasty little clause which shafts trans people. Yep, thatís right, even the time he abstained was because he was fighting for LGBT+ rights, not against them.
    2. He was the first party leader to issue a statement on the gay concentration camps in Chechnya. He condemned them in the strongest terms. And while the Greens have since joined in, none of the Tories, Labour, or UKIP have.
    3. He campaigned against section 28 from its inception, and thinks that refusing people service for their sexuality (like bakeries not baking cakes for gay marriages) is un-Christian.
    4. He spoke out on the blood donation ban (Iím still banned from giving blood, by the way - because I have had sexual relations with bisexual men).
    5. He has campaigned tirelessly for the rights of trans women in prisons, and trans issues in general. When we had a trans rights motion before conference, he was there at 9.30am in the front row to vote for it. Not because of the cameras - there were no cameras - but because he is enthusiastic about LGBT+ rights, and not just G rights with a smattering of L like many politicians.
    6. When Lib Dem conference brought in an accreditation scheme that inadvertently discriminated against LGBT+ people, he listened to us at LGBT+LDs, and then he went to head office and batted for us till the scheme was changed, and eventually dropped.
    Absolutely this.

    He wanted to avoid conflating religion and politics. Something that we all want, but has been increasing in recent years.

    His record on LGBT rights is very strong.

    He was hounded out of his position, because it was too much of a distraction. But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't respect his stance.
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  12. #170
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    I have asked several times what TM has actually done to make you lot all dislike, or hate, her so much, and thus far, I have only seen pretty superficial things mentioned, with various descriptions but very little substance to back anything up.

    i suspect it is because she is the most popular leader for many years and she happens to be a Tory.

  13. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by zztop View Post
    I have asked several times what TM has actually done to make you lot all dislike, or hate, her so much, and thus far, I have only seen pretty superficial things mentioned, with various descriptions but very little substance to back anything up.

    i suspect it is because she is the most popular leader for many years and she happens to be a Tory.

    She was a lukewarm remainer who miraculously transformed into the Iron Lady to face down the evil EU; she was either lying then about what is good for the country, or is betraying the country for political expediency. She speaks in tired cliche and soundbites. She has no spontenaiety, no wit, no personality - she seems to have made a career out of staying below the radar. She was a poor home secretary. Her exchanges with Corbyn (who I have very little time for) at PMQs expose her as a mirthless bully.
    Now I may be an idiot, but there is one thing I am not, Sir, and that, Sir, is an idiot.

  14. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by zztop View Post
    I have asked several times what TM has actually done to make you lot all dislike, or hate, her so much, and thus far, I have only seen pretty superficial things mentioned, with various descriptions but very little substance to back anything up.

    i suspect it is because she is the most popular leader for many years and she happens to be a Tory.
    Frustrating isn't it - I got the same superficial response, various descriptions but very little substance to asking why people voted brexit.

  15. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meister View Post
    There is a huge skew of people voting Lib Dem as compared to previous polls and elections.

    Anyone prepared to explain what they see attractive about the LibDems? I can see valid reasons for most of the other parties but just can't see what the LibDems offer any more?

    Not a swipe or insult I am genuinely interested.
    Take it from my old man, former tory party member turned Liberal councillor ... "You don't have to give away your worldly goods to do what's fair"

    Liberal philosophy is fairness, even now. Yes they are somewhat socialist but they won't bankrupt the country in a grand giveaway like Brown tried his best to do for labour votes. Liberals are also inclined to temper the greed of the super rich which in reality should suit 95% of the electorate but doesn't because frustratingly millions worry that one day it might include them (laughs aside).

    No I'm not a fan of Tim but I only vote for policy, personality comes second.
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