Gray’s strength is clearly his positional awareness without the ball. I’d argue it rates up there with the best. His instinct is pretty strong too. As many have said, when not given time to consider what to do he is far more effective. There are a lot of players like this. His weaknesses are clearly some elements of a poor first touch and passing. Well there are plenty in the team that are guilty of the second failing when in advanced position looking for attacking passes. Having watched the highlights from last night, whilst he should definitely buried his first chance with a bit more eye for placement over power, it wasn’t the worst connection of the ball. Many better players have missed sitters like that with the difference that they realise another good chance is likely just around the corner. Adds up to a bit less pressure. To be honest I am seriously torn when it comes to Gray. Can’t argue with the goals per minute stat. There is a lot more to the game than this. Dare I say it that he reminds me, in this respect, of Blissett. Very different players but both need(ed) a few chances per game. Somehow doubt Gray will ever get to that standing but there are similarities.
. I know you did, but given we have just played them and you'd quoted all 3 of their strikers I was just stating that I'd prefer our 3 to their 3. If I knew Ings would stay fit, that would be a close call given his previous record. However I'd certainly prefer Gray to the other 2 and sure enough he has a better scoring record. Long has appalling scoring stats in recent seasons, I'm amazed he gets a game at this level....other than last night of course !
I got crucified for saying that a few months ago . Both have/had the knack of getting in the right place at the right time, missed a few, but were seemingly unfazed by those misses to make sure they were there for the next one. Goalscorers instinct.
Obviously there are a lot of players in Spain who could improve Watford. There are players all over the world that could improve Watford, even within our range of pulling power and affordability. If you think there are better players out there who would not be tempted at £70k per week, then you'd be very mistaken. GD and Pereyra are not even on £70k. That's a lot of money for players in Europe. I will not list players as that's a big task, and it's down to the Watford board to find that player, but it's not as impossible as many would have you believe. We are not at the begging bowl. We are a very attractive club to play for. We can afford one or two quality additions this summer. Don't forget we'll get the most money ever from this seasons TV rights, because of our league placement and other revenue streams, including the cup run etc. It all adds up to a lot of money, more than we've ever had. We also made a profit in the last two transfer windows. If we can't afford one or two quality additions, then we'll never be able to get them. ….and by quality, I'm not talking about someone who is already pulling up trees. That's not how we operate, but we will be able to get the best of the best when it comes to promising young players or those who have just fallen through the cracks at bigger clubs across Europe.
Well you've clearly not read my posts, or just glossed over and cherrypicked the bits you don't like. I've said he's a good squad option and that I like him. So, again you've agreed with my point, so I'm not sure what your problem is, apart from trying to twist the meaning of what I've said.
Apart from scoring late winners, equalisers and providing numerous assists Gray has done **** all recently.
People criticize him for missing chances but u have to be in the right place at the right time in the first place to get the chance. Obviously luther was a better player than Dre but both are fearless strikers who no defence can stop getting into goalscoring positions. Luther's goals per minute was probably 10-20% better than Andre's. Andre is certainly not a poor man's Luther Blissett but not not quite up there with the great man himself.
I was actually pondering the Goals/Min across the Prem. None of the WhoScores etc sites have an option which I can fathom to do this. In my day, I was a studious Fantasy Football participant. A key ratio for me is Points/Pound/Minute. Using D Tel data, these are the season to date top strikers: Jiminez 1.32 Gray 1.20 Wilson 1.11 Deeney 1.05 Long 1.00 Aguero 0.98 Son 0.96 King 0.95 Lacazette 0.94 Clearly, the value of the player (which stays the same over the season in this format) has a major bearing. Over the years, though, there are few major anomalies. Jiminez is the obvious one this season. Only Aguero has scored more points in absolute terms than him although the Masked One is priced squarely in the value bracket. Over the seasons, anything over 0.95 for a striker is pretty impressive. Jesus & Aubameyang are both around 0.90. Not perfect but indicative. A little crude but a decent Moneyball index. The kind of measure Gino might scrutinise. AG isn't the second best striker in the league but it is highly suggestive that his output is above expectation & he is delivering great value.
Good analogy. Hence GT insisting on 25 crosses a match. Luther was never a fox in the box but give him 10 chances & he would score.
Whatever you think of Wicardi, desirous of feasting on his masculine juices or leading a torchlit pitchforked mob towards his dwelling in the middle of the night, this is a ludicrous metric/question. He's a centre forward, not a centre back. Him losing the ball doesn't work like that; it could go through several phases subsequently and still be originally down to him (in terms of rating his effectiveness). A more pertinent question given his position and role would be 'can anyone name a time Gray has given the ball away leading to a promising Watford attack being ruined' to which, to be fair, the answer would be 'yes, several, everyone can, from last night alone.'
All our players give the ball away. I remember when we lost at home to luton in the cup with f****** Foley and Norvile up front!!!!!!
You can't really argue with his strike rate, which is around 10-15 goals. How many other, home-grown players do you think we could buy for less than £15 million?
Long is a terrible finisher. He took his goal well but could've had a hat-trick last night. He's scored 4 this season, 2 last season, 3 the season before that, only hit double figures in the prem once out of his 8 seasons. That's a terrible goal return, he doesn't even assist much either. He's fast and that's about it (and at 32 that pace will soon be disappearing)
I was starting to wonder whether people were losing interest in this forum. All that was needed was an off day to provide a match thread that extends beyond half a dozen pages. I’ll be expected at least 20 pages when we lose against the Wolf people on Saturday.
Surely it was the Romans who did all those things. Personally speaking, I would much rather have the Romans upfront for us.
Nowadays, everybody wanna talk like they got something to say but nothing comes out when they move their lips. Just a bunch of gibberish and ************* act like they forgot about Dre.
In the Premier League most other teams do their homework: By now they know how we play and generally takes steps to neutralize it or even take advantage of it. Last night Hassenhuttl and his players did just that and should be congratulated for it. In addition, I felt they were helped by a lot of our players showing a lack of flexibility and generally being below par (worryingly exhausted and end-of-season, in fact).
How on earth can you compare Gray and Luther? Honestly. Luther had his faults but he was as near a complete forward as this club has ever had; could play target man, could play off the shoulder, had pace and power, would happily run the channels all day, could score with his head, could score with his feet, knew when to be in the right place at the right time. If you could somehow merge Deeney and Gray I'd say that would get you somewhere near to a Luther.
Saying that Gray wont take us to the next level does not even make any sense. He has already helped to take us to the next level. His goals have been important goals that have won us points that make finishing 7th and qualifying for Europe a realistic possibility. To have a striker who scores goals which win points is a real asset. He doesnt even take penalties for us and would have scored about another 5 for us if he was the penalty taker. Anyone with a one in three goal scoring ratio ( as proven by Gray's three seasons in the Premier League) is a Premier League standard player. He has also helped to take us to the next level in the FA Cup - scoring the opener in the 4th round away to Newcastle and scoring the winner in the 6th round to Palace. He was also on the pitch for the entire game in the semi final and showed skill in setting up the winning goal. Gray wont take us to the next level if you mean taking the place of a top 6 team but that isnt going to happen anyway if we have a policy of selling our best players for profit. If we had that ambition I would of kept Richardison his value will go up every year at the age he is with how well he has generally done this season. Watford fans do like to moan. Most were more than happy to sell Richarldison as he wasn't a goalscorer. Ighalo, even during his goalscoring form was berated for missing easy opportunities, not being any good at link up play and for conceding possession. When Ighalo stopped scoring he became a liability. As long as Gray scores he is adding points to our record and therby improving our standing in the league. So many Watford fans have said Gray is the worst striker to play for us - especially last season - but it simply isnt true. We look more dangerous as a team when he plays - that even applies to last season. His link up play is poor but not as bad as his doubters say. His link up play earlier in the season at home to Man Utd ( when he scored) was very good. He was the difference when brought on at half time at home to Fulham recently and most said bringing him on was the difference - in a game he didnt even get a goal in. Would we be any better off having a technically superior player such as Vietto from Fulham who has only one goal in the Premier League this season despite playing a lot more than Gray has been playing? Gray's impact doesnt make sense because he has flaws that make him appear to be a lower league standard footballer. But he is a very effective footballer and is worthy of being in a Premier League squad.
All of them looked to me to care a lot: In fact they looked anxious and exhausted and quite a lot of them displayed why they are not playing in top 6 teams: i.e. they got flustered and took wrong decisions at the wrong times. Examples would be Deleufeu and Pereyra and Doucoure taking too long in front of goal, allowing the attacks to lose momentum. But that is not indicative of lack of effort, which is the default criticism from so many British football followers - any failing whatsoever is seen merely as a lack of effort.
Not if he's hiding in Peru, aged 15 and playing in bare feet - which is presumably where the Pozzos will be looking. 'Let's make them, not buy them'.
I completely agree about the need for sourcing promising youth but my point was as written "Anyone with a decent scoring track record will be out of our price range." - by scoring record I hadn't meant Lima Boys Brigade U16s
Ngonge? This thread could turn into the Wolves Entitlement one if we are claiming Gray is the worst prem striker ever.
I didn't say he was the worst Premier League striker ever. I said he is the worst striker in terms of purely his technical ability, whilst also noting that he still finds a way to be effective at times.
Excluding his pace, movement, work rate, stamina, hunger, desire, ability to get clear-cut chances, goalscoring prowess and track record of scoring vital game changing goals there's not much to him really.
According to understat.com Andre Gray's goal tally this season is actually slightly higher than his XG (expected goals). Put that in your pipes and smoke it.
