Are the Chinese swimmers using drugs? [Archive]

wfcmoog

28-07-2012, 09:00 PM

Was interesting listening to Sharon Davies talking about the systematic doping by East German athletes in her day. Everyone knew it went on, but little was done about it.

I am of the opinion that there is massive doping still going on across major sports. I reckon several "stars" are using banned substances. It's a race between testers and dopers. when nobodies being caught, it means the dopers are winning.

cyaninternetdog

28-07-2012, 09:14 PM

Sure i saw an outboard motor on one of them.

mean

28-07-2012, 09:58 PM

Watch the Women's 400m medley final and tell me they aren't.

I must admit the same thought crossed my mind when I watched it.

steve harrow

28-07-2012, 10:15 PM

Watch the Women's 400m medley final and tell me they aren't.

It was incredible and even the presenters raised the possibility. If she's clean, I presume this girl will win every tournament in the near future. Should this be a one off.... Very suspect.

matimbers

28-07-2012, 11:33 PM

You look at someone like Rebecca Adlington and it's very obvious that she is a swimmer, her build and muscles give it away, the Chinese girl in my opinion, doesn't look like that, yet how can she swim that fast? At the end it was a joke, she just looked like a machine who could go on and on whilst the others were tiring.

I she doesn't fail a drugs test, I bet we never hear anything else from her again. Anyone remember Michelle de Bruin from Ireland who suddenly came from nowhere at Atlanta and one all those golds? The same here.

Failing that, the Chinese have managed to cross-breed women with fish!

Defunct

28-07-2012, 11:37 PM

I am of the opinion that there is massive doping still going on across major sports. I reckon several "stars" are using banned substances. It's a race between testers and dopers. when nobodies being caught, it means the dopers are winning.

Totally agree, there can be no doubt now, the druggies are winning the battle against the chasers.

99mph

29-07-2012, 12:32 AM

She beat her personal best time by 5 seconds...

Also, you don't just beat the World Record by 1 second. You just don't.

ALSO (again). She did her 100m freestyle part quicker than Lochte did his.............

wfc4ever

29-07-2012, 02:18 AM

They've been caught out before in the 90s....

PFCFitz,YellowArmy

29-07-2012, 07:24 AM

I really hope and wish China gets in and contributes to swimming like they do with gymnastics, but I really hope they aren't doping.

wfcmoog

29-07-2012, 09:39 AM

I really hope and wish China gets in and contributes to swimming like they do with gymnastics, but I really hope they aren't doping.

I'm on the opposite side of the fence from you Fitz. I hate China as a nation. Evil bloody bastewards.

I hope they get exposed for the doping, cheating SOBs they undoubtedly are. They won't though. They probably told Cameron that if we test their man-girls at the Olympics, they'll call in all their debts.

El distraído

29-07-2012, 09:49 AM

I smell a rat.

matimbers

29-07-2012, 10:21 AM

I smell a rat.

Eating them is part of her training regime.

Smudger

29-07-2012, 11:03 AM

When you have a sixteen year old beat the world's best and complete the last 100 metres in under 60 seconds after 300m of exhaustive swimming and then not look tired at all something is up. Ditto for the men's winner.

They've found a new drug which cannot be tested for at present. Such results should raise suspicion. And they have form when they were breaking the great Kristina Egerszegi's records for fun.

Also in the mens gymnastics amazing how some of the GB competitors scores were marked. Obvious faults and deductions like tucking low on landing and stepping forward in the vault for instance seem to have been missed by the judges. Homerism ? This seems to happen at all Olympic gymnastic events.

Handball and basketball teams thumped comprehensively too. Nice to see so many of the posh seats empty. Well done Locog. A games for the people eh ? Or for the corporates ?

Evasive

29-07-2012, 11:05 AM

The empty seats issue is one that is disappointing after the rigmarole of the ticket application system.

wfc4ever

29-07-2012, 12:05 PM

The empty seats issue is one that is disappointing after the rigmarole of the ticket application system.

Even the cycling is pretty empty today...probably due to the rain and lack of expectation for the women's race.

PFCFitz,YellowArmy

29-07-2012, 07:49 PM

I'm on the opposite side of the fence from you Fitz. I hate China as a nation. Evil bloody bastewards.

I hope they get exposed for the doping, cheating SOBs they undoubtedly are. They won't though. They probably told Cameron that if we test their man-girls at the Olympics, they'll call in all their debts.
We may not be so opposite side of the fence as you think. As a political entity, I am not a fan of China at all, but... The people of China are hard working long suffering intelligent folks. Those people who swim and gym and perform deserve success. The system "The People's" Republic of China crams athletes into is an extension of the state and if they really are cheating, it is a shame for the actual people of China.

That's what's so admirable about places like South Korea to me. They compete hard and do it mostly fairly. That is a real credit to their nation in my opinion.

Having swam for years competitively growing up, what that 16 year old Chinese girl did was inhuman. I really can't see that as natural. It's a shame if it is really doping. On the other hand, if they can dope like that, why aren't there Chinese armies of cyclists and distance runners and weight lifters sweeping the podiums?

wfcmoog

29-07-2012, 07:56 PM

I hate China, not the Chinese. Well, I hate some Chinese. Some others are lovely.

However, I do suspect doping and not only in swimming. Maybe I've been brainwashed by the capitalist pigs of the West, but when a commie country suddenly pops up winning everything in sight, I believe it's often a combination of doping, huge resources (fair enough) and more doping.

I'm sure China have some very good athletes who aren't doping, but for me, there are too many surprises which have popped up over the past 4 years, not only in swimming, to be all down to good training and diet.

There are different drugs for different sports and some are better tested than others. That's why I presume they might have found it easier to sneak more drugs into swimmers than in other sports.

wfcmoog

29-07-2012, 08:04 PM

Ruta Meilutyte - 15 years old - just broke the European record for 100m breaststroke in the semi final. Representing Lithuania - Lives in Plymouth and trained by a British Coach at a British swimming programme. Why haven't we snapped her up for GB? Offer her a job in Pret a Mange and £2000 and we'd have a GB gold medalist. FML.

Birdydoug

29-07-2012, 08:05 PM

Vespa Crabro

29-07-2012, 08:20 PM

I think they should introduce a third Olympic games to make it fair.

1st Normal Olympics.

2nd Para Olympics.

3rd Free Olympics. This one is on drugs , you can take as many as you want as long as you declare it before the games.

I tried this about 20 years ago as an experiment with some mates on a beach around 5am. The results were inconclusive and I nearly coughed up a lung. Funny as hell though.

Estuary Hornet

29-07-2012, 10:18 PM

I'm sorry, but that 16 year old swimmer has to be doping, you don't just knock 5 seconds off your previous best and swim 100m freestyle quicker than Lochte.

PFCFitz,YellowArmy

30-07-2012, 05:01 PM

A US swim coach calls foul, but explains it pretty well. (http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/jul/30/ye-shiwen-world-record-olympics-2012)

"You can't turn around and call it racism to say the Chinese have a doping history," Leonard said. "That is just history. That's fact. Does that make us suspicious? Of course. You have to question any outrageous performance, and that is an outrageous performance, unprecedented in any way, shape or form in the history of our sport. It by itself, regardless of whether she was Chinese, Lithuanian, Kenyan, or anything else, is impossible. Sorry."

Leonard rejected comparisons to Michael Phelps, who broke the 200m butterfly world record when he was just 15, back in 2001. "Phelps got consistently faster every year on a normal improvement curve. There has never been anything that you look at in any of Mr Phelps' swims that you look at and say 'well, that's impossible, that can't be done.'" He made a point of saying that he also had no qualms whatsoever about the performance of other Chinese swimmers, including the new Olympic 400m freestyle champion Sun Yang, 20. "He has a perfectly normal improvement curve, he is a dramatically spectacular athlete in our sport and I've no question about him at all. But a woman does not out-swim the fastest man in the world in the back quarter of a 400m IM that is otherwise quite ordinary. It just doesn't happen."

wfcmoog

30-07-2012, 05:13 PM

A US swim coach calls foul, but explains it pretty well. (http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/jul/30/ye-shiwen-world-record-olympics-2012)

That's pretty much my assessment of Ussain Bolt.

PFCFitz,YellowArmy

30-07-2012, 05:51 PM

Was he out of the blue, too? Or did he have a gradual progression to the top?

wfcmoog

30-07-2012, 06:00 PM

Was he out of the blue, too? Or did he have a gradual progression to the top?

I think, to be fair, he was always on his way to the top, from Junior onwards. However, taking a promising youngster to smash the World Record by .30 seconds or whatever it was doesn't mean that it is believable.

And there's the whole Jamaican dominance of all sprinting, male and female to explain. Where did that come from? Not just a golden generation of 2-4 athletes, but dozens of them all coming through in one era.

And there's no off season drugs testing in Jamaica.

Hornmeister

30-07-2012, 06:43 PM

One side effect of performance enhancing drugs is a spotty back. Quit common in pro wrestlers where steroid abuse is rife, but publically frowned upon.

I've seen quite a few zitty backs in glorious HD.

ForzaWatford

30-07-2012, 09:33 PM

I studied this in PE. They could easily be gene doping, it's undetectable and unknown at the moment. It's not unreasonable that China could have discovered how to do it properly. HGH is also effective and is only detectable in the body for 24 hours after use, so could easily be used and not caught.

99mph

30-07-2012, 09:36 PM

Apparently there is a well established use of doping in the Tour D'France, they used to avoid detection by *ahem* injecting clean urine...up themselves...

PFCFitz,YellowArmy

31-07-2012, 12:13 AM

Oh jesus

AshdonWFC

31-07-2012, 01:31 AM

I would love to think that this sort of thing wasn't a problem in sport anymore. Some of the stuff we've been seeing is unreal. For example the Chinese girl who swam quicker than Ryan Lochte. It just seems a bit too quick.

It's a bit of a shame that people have doubts, but it'll always be the case unfortunately whilst nations seek a definitive edge over another.

steve harrow

31-07-2012, 08:02 AM

Seems like it's been looked into...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19058769

YellowHornets

31-07-2012, 09:23 PM

The 16 year old won another gold tonight, maybe she's just a very good swimmer.

SM#16

31-07-2012, 09:53 PM

She's ridiculous.

wfc4ever

31-07-2012, 09:54 PM

TBF A 15 year old won who wasn't from China...

Ofcourse people will be cynical though..they would be if we had a 16 year old multiple medal winner I guess.

SM#16

31-07-2012, 10:10 PM

TBF A 15 year old won who wasn't from China...

Ofcourse people will be cynical though..they would be if we had a 16 year old multiple medal winner I guess.

That's nonsense and you know it, the 15 year old didn't only start swimming 3 years ago, the 15 year old wasn't 4th on the last turn of a medley and then managed to win by 2 body lengths, the 15 year old didn't beat the entire male competitors in the same event (of which the winner had got the second fastest time in something or other)

cyaninternetdog

31-07-2012, 10:23 PM

The 16 year old won another gold tonight, maybe she's just a very good swimmer.

Im more or less certain she held back in the last 25 metres.

wfc4ever

31-07-2012, 10:45 PM

That's nonsense and you know it, the 15 year old didn't only start swimming 3 years ago, the 15 year old wasn't 4th on the last turn of a medley and then managed to win by 2 body lengths, the 15 year old didn't beat the entire male competitors in the same event (of which the winner had got the second fastest time in something or other)

That is a fair point..I didn't realise the girl from China only started swimming 3 years ago though.

SM#16

31-07-2012, 10:47 PM

Something like that, her school teacher recommended swimming because she had bigger hands/feet

YellowHornets

31-07-2012, 11:09 PM

Im more or less certain she held back in the last 25 metres.

Just heard on TalkSport that she's 'clean' and no doping was involved, actually quite shocked because she did seem a bit too fast & it did look like she could've gone faster than she did tonight and she still finished a fair bit in front of 2nd place. I dont know, maybe they've found a way around of them picking up on drugs?

The Voice of Reason

01-08-2012, 06:57 AM

Just heard on TalkSport that she's 'clean' and no doping was involved, actually quite shocked because she did seem a bit too fast & it did look like she could've gone faster than she did tonight and she still finished a fair bit in front of 2nd place. I dont know, maybe they've found a way around of them picking up on drugs?

This might be true, but I couldn't possibly comment!!!

SM#16

01-08-2012, 07:54 AM

Just heard on TalkSport that she's 'clean' and no doping was involved, actually quite shocked because she did seem a bit too fast & it did look like she could've gone faster than she did tonight and she still finished a fair bit in front of 2nd place. I dont know, maybe they've found a way around of them picking up on drugs?

TalkSport talking out their arse as usual.

As long as theirs drug testers, there's people inventing new performance enhancing drugs that will slip under the radar.

wfcmoog

01-08-2012, 10:07 AM

TalkSport talking out their arse as usual.

As long as theirs drug testers, there's people inventing new performance enhancing drugs that will slip under the radar.

Exactly this.

It's happened before and more relevantly, it's happened with China. A few years back they suddenly emerged at a World Championships with loads of medalists, all tested clean. It wasn't until the subsequent Asian games a few months later, that something like 11 of their medals were rescinded for failed drugs tests.

A Chinese swimmer passing a drugs test only proves to me that their drugs are better than the testing.

Hornmeister

01-08-2012, 10:14 AM

Defunct

01-08-2012, 10:36 AM

Alternatively, With a massive gene pool and a few million resources chucked behind it, are we seeing a fairer distribution of medals now. The west have traditionally won a disproportionate amount of medals due to a higher investment in sports facilities training and support, something other countries are now overtaking.

That's a fair point, but you would see them sneaking up and then overtaking in World Championships and breaking World Records in other events if that was the case, times and performances would gradually get better as their programs made ground.

This girl reminds me of the Mad Max films when he injects nitrous oxide into the engine and it accelerates madly.

Hornmeister

01-08-2012, 10:57 AM

is Noz on the banned list?

matimbers

01-08-2012, 11:05 AM

That's a fair point, but you would see them sneaking up and then overtaking in World Championships and breaking World Records in other events if that was the case, times and performances would gradually get better as their programs made ground.

This girl reminds me of the Mad Max films when he injects nitrous oxide into the engine and it accelerates madly.

Perhaps she is on a diet of baked beans and is getting jet propelled help!