Bristol City Team & match reaction

[Hornmeister]

WATFORD: Loach; Mariappa, Taylor, DeMerit (c), Doyley; Cowie, Eustace, Lansbury, Harley; Helguson, Graham. Subs: McGinn, Jenkins, Lee (gk), Bennett, Henderson, Bryan, Hodson.
BRISTOL CITY: Gerken; Orr, Carey (c), Fontaine, McAllister; Johnson, Skuse, Nyatanga, Saborlo; Agyemang, Clarkson. Subs: Elliott, Hartley, Collis (c), Williams, Sproule, Wilson, Sno.

[krisvad]

So a return to the 4-4-2 - good when playing a side like Brizzle who are in even worse form than ourselves.

Interesting to see 6 of our own academy players on the bench along with the two on the pitch.

[hornetmaster]

So a return to the 4-4-2 - good when playing a side like Brizzle who are in even worse form than ourselves.

Interesting to see 6 of our own academy players on the bench along with the two on the pitch.

3 5 2 For Brizzle - so the midfield battle will be interesting, which needs to provide service to H & Danny.

PS. Radio Bristol say Martin Taylor looks like a man mountain:biggrin:

[Hornmeister]

PS. Radio Bristol say Martin Taylor looks like a man mountain:biggrin:


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/06/12/article-0-018E980300000578-669_468x515.jpg

[Rontaylor]

1-0 despite Bristol having 60% possession (after 16 minutes)

[Bournemouth Dom]

Hoskins nowhere to be seen after being on bench for last few games and coming on against Barnsley. Injured or possible loan move in pipeline?

[barton horns]

just got in down in Hampshire. any update on match

[Bobby Downes]

two nil, last i heard

[Jersey Hornet]

good win, now lets improve away!

[mike88]

Job done.

Very pleased with Taylor. Might have only played 3 games so far but seems a superb acquisition.

Well done lads. Looking forward to the match ratings.

[With A Smile]

that will do. 11th, 13 points above the drop zone, survival this season is all we want so another good 3 points towards that goal

[crofton36]

2.0 full time, good first half poor 2nd, at least we had another clean sheet .
:sign15: :sign15:

[UEA_Hornet]

That'll do. Malky has to work out the away enigma but so long as we keep winning or at least not losing at home he'll have the summer preparing for another Championship season to work it out. Two clean sheets in three games since Taylor came in...that'll be the key when we look back in May I think.

[Bubble]

2-0. Good win, even if it was an ugly performance at times. 3 points is what's crucial at this stage of the season. Our impressive home record goes on!

Good win.

[UEA_Hornet]

that will do. 11th, 13 points above the drop zone, l

8pts, not 13?!

EDIT: In fact 6pts as Reading have just gone 2-1 up.

[DMR]

Couldn't attend the game due to work, however despite a poor second half it's good to get three points regardless.

[mike88]

8pts, not 13?!

EDIT: In fact 6pts as Reading have just gone 2-1 up.

Christ that's tight! Only 11 points between drop zone and playoffs... At least it means this 2-0 win tonight is even more important.

[With A Smile]

8pts, not 13?!

EDIT: In fact 6pts as Reading have just gone 2-1 up.

sure it was more earlier.

still only another 14 points needed

[Squibba]

another clean sheet, Taylor was brilliant and a striker's finish, not too keen on Malky's substitutions but cant complain too much, first half we could be play off contenders second half relegation threatened team which was a bit worrying, still unbeaten in 2010 ;) now let's get some away wins (:

[Pikey_Power]

Good result and another clean sheet at home :sign15:

Jenkins and Henderson looked off the pace a bit when they came on though

[Harrow Orn]

Whole back 4 played fantastic.

[matimbers]

Good win helped by the formation of Bristol City in the first half, once they went to a 442 in the second half it was all them without having any real clear cut chances, only one header which produced another top class save from the best keeper outside the Premier League.

The first goal was due to an outstanding cross from Mariappa, you could not have wanted a better cross from the byline and it led to a very easy Heider header. The second goal was a very good finish from Taylor, side footed it in on the volley from a tight angle after a well flighted free kick. We were aided by some appalling fouls from Bristol, at least 2 could have gone and they were niggling and moaning all evening to the ref who was up their with Atwell in terms of performance, absolutely dire and giving all the niggly stuff and then bottling anything major.

MOTM by was Doyley, closely followed by Taylor (so great to have a commanding central defender again) absolutely brilliant tonight, 2 passes went astray but his defending was supurb and linked up really well with Harley. Eutace was very poor tonight I thought which led to Lansbury having to do a lot of his work, and was suprised to see him taken off for Jenkins (unless it was to rest his legs). Cowie was annomonous in the first half, picked up more in the second but his performances lately have also been bad. I think when Cleverly is fit, i would give Harley a run and drop Cowie.

Up front still worries me. I wonder if Heider and Graham actually get on as there does not seem to be much communication and they either seem to be very close together almost getting in each others way or too far apart. Don't get me wrong, Graham is playing well, there just seems to be something wrong. Don't know why Hoskins was not on bench (perhaps off on loan?) but we brought on Henderson again and all he did was run around with that weird chest out technique and loose the ball/fall over. Really puts in 100% but we needed someone to run the channels and use their pace up front in the last 20mins, he was not the answer.

Anyway, another win at home, this form should keep us up i reckon. Well done Malky and the lads

[ImRonBurgundy?]

Dont mean to pick on the negatives but how bad was Henderson when he came on? final nail in his coffin for me imo, put hoskins or sordell on the bench, at least theyre quick

[inayellowshirt]

good result on paper.. awful game

Pros:

Mariappa
Doyley
Demerit
Taylor
(notice a pattern there?)
good first half
Helguson trade mark attack on the far post from a great Marriappa cross
Taylors finish from the free kick

Cons:

2nd half... absolutely terrible
Bristol Citys fouling... dirty seenuts
Bit of small guy syndrome from City player
Henderson. Waste of a sub
Weather... brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[NathWFC]

Good result and another clean sheet at home :sign15:

Jenkins and Henderson looked off the pace a bit when they came on though

Probably something to do with that fact that Henderson is absolutely cr*p.

Other than that another good home win by the sounds of it, it's getting the points on the board that matters.

[nak108]

Good win. The game reminded me a lot of our 2-0 win against Preston this season. First half we really attacked the game, went at Bristol at a fast pace and grabbed two goals. Second half meanwhile was just a case of consolidation and holding on. To be fair we did that and although at times Bristol had quite a bit of possession there weren't a huge amount of goalscoring chances for them. I thought our passing at times was very good and once again there was a certain blend of styles. Helguson's goal stemmed from a lovely little pass from Eustace over the top to Mariappa who, one-on-one with the defender on the wing took him on and sent a lovely cross to the backpost for Helguson to head home. Taylor's goal came when Lansbury from around the half way line sent in a nice free kick for Taylor to volley home brilliantly.

Loach- 7 Wasn't tested a great deal but his kicking was very good and he pulled off one fantastic save. He also looked a bit more dominating today.

Mariappa- 6.5 Had a decent game. His attacking looked very good again and he is showing a lot of skill on the ball as well as getting a great assist. He also put in a couple of decent crosses, crosses were however the problem at the other end as I do feel that a few too many crosses came into the box on his side.

Taylor- 8 Brilliant, almost faultless at the back and he grabbed a lovely goal. In defence he was a rock, nothing got past him, he won a ton of headers from both crosses and long balls and his passing was good as well. Just his presence seems to bring out a lot more in other players.

DeMerit- 7 Good solid game. Did well in the air, played off Taylor well and his passing was decent enough.

Doyley- 6.5 Got forward very well, showed some clever movement amazingly and he put in quite a few crosses. Defensively he did pretty well but let in too many crosses along with Mariappa.

Cowie- 7 Worked hard, showed a good amount of solidarity, his passing was also good and it was quite a typical Cowie performance.

Lansbury- 6 Worked hard and he got stuck in but too many passes didn't reach his target. A lot of his passes were intercepted and he didn't get as involved in the game as usual.

Eustace- 6 Like Lansbury he worked very hard and showed some good defensive play but there were too many poor passes. Some his passes were very good but he majority just weren't good enough.

Harley- 7 Thought he had a good game, especially in the first half. First half he showed a lot of skill and he put in some dangerous crosses and second half it was just a case of putting in a solid performance. Harley's usual work rate was once again displayed.

Graham- 6.5 Displayed some really great touches and passes but he wasn't really involved a huge amount. There were no real attacking oppurtunities for him so he didn't really have a chance to score, I couldn't tell whether he didn't get these chances because of poor play by him though. His work-rate looked good initially but as the game wore on he didn't look as determined to win the ball and he tired, was definitely the right decision to take him off although I may have done it earlier.

Helguson- 7.5 Did fantastically well in the air from both long balls and crosses and he scored a nice goal. He also showed some good touches in the game, some nice passes and a good work-rate.

Subs:

Henderson- 6 Worked hard and showed some decent touches and passes but struggled when looking to get in behind the defence. Really got stuck in as well.

Jenkins- 6 Not much time to make an impact but he did show one good turn and pass in the small amount of time he had.

[Smithy]

Match was decent, second half was quite bad but still 3 points is 3 points. Thought the defence was good, Mariappa certainly in the first half. Don't know why Malky constantly has the need to bring Henderson on in the final 10 minutes, alright it was only 10 minutes but he had a few chances to at least run at the ball but he somehow made it seem that he was tired or something. Where the bloody hell is Hoskins? He deserved at least a bench appearence and its a bit of a joke if he's behind Henderson in the pecking order. Bristol city put in a couple of rough tackles and 1 or 2 of their players should of got 2 yellows, but of course we're Watford and the bad referee curse on us has still continued.

Bring on QPR away next week, would love it to win there but not too sure with our away record and that Helguson won't be allowed to play. Danny Graham is yet to get a goal since S****horpe at home, Helguson has lapped him in goals this season. Hope Cleverley is back for next week.

[Aberystwyth_Hornet]

Important win especially as we aren't playing on Saturday. League is as tight as it was last season, maybe more so.

Need to get a positive result against QPR

Hands are numb with cold.

2nd half we were poor but that may have been as much to do with the job being done and Bristol bringing on 2 players at half time...suggests Johnson had words with the players

[wfc4ever]

Very confident performance although maybe a good thing Bristol City were so hopeless up front even when having most of the ball 2nd half but that was down to some very good assured defending.

Excellent cross by Mariappa and Doyley was very solid along with Taylor/JD.

Got to say neither Graham and Henderson really impressed me in their time on the pitch which might be a little worry for next week at QPR if H isn't able to play.

Another home win...and nice to keep the home form going.

Shame we'll probably go down a few places comg Saturday!

[matimbers]

Henderson- 6 Worked hard and showed some decent touches and passes but struggled when looking to get in behind the defence. Really got stuck in as well.


You post some great stuff Nak and I admit, Henderson had a good appearance as sub a couple of months ago but today he lost everthing or fell over (one time getting us a very lucky free kick though!). How can he be given even a 6 though, due to him, we never held the ball up top and were put under constant pressure. What we needed was someone to win the ball, keep hold of it and run at them. He does not have the ability for the Championship, I reckon he could be a decent right back or something, just not a striker at this level.

[nak108]

You post some great stuff Nak and I admit, Henderson had a good appearance as sub a couple of months ago but today he lost everthing or fell over (one time getting us a very lucky free kick though!). How can he be given even a 6 though, due to him, we never held the ball up top and were put under constant pressure. What we needed was someone to win the ball, keep hold of it and run at them. He does not have the ability for the Championship, I reckon he could be a decent right back or something, just not a striker at this level.

I actually think it was one of the worst performances I've seen from him, he really struggled to get in behind the defence but when it came to holding possession and playing the ball, he did well.

Not a great performance though.

[matimbers]

Got to say neither Graham and Henderson really impressed me in their time on the pitch which might be a little worry for next week at QPR if H isn't able to play.

I think Graham on his own will be fine, i forgot that Heider can't play so would assume a fit Cleverley will come in to the middle of the park and link with Lansbury

[wfc4ever]

BTW How did Bristol City keep 11 men on the pitch!

They did their best to hack us to bits...

No wonder they're in bad form if that is their level of discipline.

We had them rattled first half.

[wfcwarehouse]

Henderson- 6 Worked hard and showed some decent touches and passes but struggled when looking to get in behind the defence. Really got stuck in as well.


Oh, sensational, my sides have split. What a load of tosh. Henderson was absolute, un-adulterated $hit when he came on. He did absolutely nothing. I remember one instance where a ball was hit forward. Graham would've chased it, but Henderson instead proceeded to canter after it not paying much attention and thus, a chance was wasted. There is NO WAY (imo) he should be ahead of Hoskins (and I don't like Hoskins) in the pecking order. Sorry Nak, but I totally disagree with you on this one.

That said, I'm pleased with the points. Sure, we huffed and puffed at times and rode our luck in places, but Bristol City are no mugs and they usually do pretty well against us. DG had a very good game today, he ran the channels well and did a lot of donkey-work, a good all round performance. In the first half we could've had a few more goals, we were very good and looked comfortable. I was expecting more of the same in the second half and I'm quite baffled as why we went so defensive in the second half. Our defence kept us in it at times, Taylor in particuarly looked fairly decent to me. That being the first time I've seen him since we signed him, he looks a good piece of business from MM. Loach impressed me in places, a bit hesitant on his line sometimes but dealt well with most things including one great stop from a header in the second half.

Finally, am I the only one who noticed what a bunch of cave-men Bristol City were? If they weren't lumping the ball up the pitch without much finesse/direction, they were kicking/sliding/biting/pulling/nudging lumps out of our players. They were VERY lucky to finish with 11 men if you ask me. The ref was far, far too weak and should've, perhaps could've sent off 1 or 2 of their players.

[ImRonBurgundy?]

I actually think it was one of the worst performances I've seen from him, he really struggled to get in behind the defence but when it came to holding possession and playing the ball, he did well.

Not a great performance though.

He should have had a 1 or 2, not a 6

he was on the pitch for 15 minutes yet he wouldnt run, he was slow, looked tired, fell over, didnt press the defenders

he was brought on to play on the shoulder and stretch the Bristol defence, yet he refused to make runs in behind and just ran around like a headless chicken

tonight was the last straw for me as far as hes concerned

[His Royal Hornet]

Another handy 3 points at home, and 2 good goals as well. We played well today, but one thing that I would say is that we seemed to try and close out what was a very average Bristol City team too early. They were lacking any sort of major pacey attacking threat, as both Campbell Ryce and Maynard were out through injury and Sno was injured during the warm up (I was wondering if he was the one that was stretchered off at the end of the warm up?). The goal from Heidar was a good headed finish, and the second goal was a well worked free kick, with a fantastic striker's finish from Martin Taylor. If we play like this regularly and pick up 3 points from the majority of winnable home games, the poor away form is less of a concern (take Burnley as an example)

Loach- 7 Quiet day for him because of the lack of attacking threat, was good in the air and pulled of one stunning save.

Mariappa- 6 A good performance, but I would say that sometimes he needs to be more decisive when he is putting in a cross, or when he is deciding to cross or pass, as he lost the ball in a good position a few times, which becomes frustrating.

Taylor- 8 Great performance, although one early mistake was almost costly. I think if Jay DeMerit was to go, Taylor could be a candidate to be the new captain. Also a great finish from him (It certainly came quicker than Doyley's first goal for the club!)

DeMerit- 6 Good performance, a number of saving tackles, but the lack of communication and arguing between him and Mariappa is immature and they need to sort it out if they are playing together.

Doyley- 6.5 Usual Lloyd performance, he shows some good touches, one flick of note, and also the other side of Lloyd, such as a foul throw and running the ball out, instead of kicking it out when DG was down.

Cowie- 7 Another solid performance, maybe one thing that let him down was that some of his deliveries from corners and free kicks were either wasteful or not well worked.

Lansbury- 6.5 He worked hard, put some of the passing in the midfield was poor today anyway, which didn't help him anyway.

Eustace- 6.5 Was better defensively than in midfield. Made some nice passes, but some were wasteful.

Harley- 7 Good game, played well defensively and down the wing as well.

Graham- 6 Good start from Danny, although after he was injured in one of the tackles, he didn't seem to chase things down as much, decreasing his chances and lowering his work rate.
Helguson- 7 Solid performance, nice finish for the goal and was also commanding in the air, especially from longer balls.

Subs:

Henderson- 4 Very average performance, at times he was running round like a headless chicken. I really don't think he can cut it at this level.

Jenkins- 5 Not enough time to make a major impact, showed one nice touch.

[SM#16]

Henderson is ****ing *****.

Also was it me, or did the referee book the wrong person late in the second half for an elbow on Helguson, and then proceeded to give someone else (Elliot?) a second yellow without a red..

[Aberystwyth_Hornet]

Henderson is ****ing *****.

Also was it me, or did the referee book the wrong person late in the second half for an elbow on Helguson, and then proceeded to give someone else (Elliot?) a second yellow without a red..

I was convinced the ref had already booked the number 7, they were lucky to only get 5 yellows.

[SM#16]

Yeah number 7 was Elliot, I'm sure he'd booked him earlier also! Thought Nyatanga was going to get his marching orders for the second time against us this season, grotty little ****.

[wfcwarehouse]

Yeah number 7 was Elliot, I'm sure he'd booked him earlier also! Thought Nyatanga was going to get his marching orders for the second time against us this season, grotty little ****.

I thought he'd booked someone twice without a red too. Maybe I was getting confused because so many of their players got booked!

[Defunct]

Enjoyed that, but how cold was it? Five layers and still felt it!

Sat with an ex pro tonight, so got some decent insight into our play. He said that Taylor was immense, (fairly obvious that one), but Bristol played right into our hands, said Graham was MOM for his hold up play and the fact that he found another yellow shirt with every ball, and that when we didn't have possesion our shape was superb.

I just thought we wanted it more! I was sitting right behind the Bristol volley on the stroke of half time that Mariappa got his head to, and that was 100% going into the net had Mariappa not got in the way. Another 3 points closer to that safety net.

[SM#16]

Also three non-football related.

1) The annoying jebend who sits behind me, don't give a running commentary on what is happening, I can ****ing see. Also I don't give two turds about how you went to Barcelona on a Geography field trip 4 years ago and that is why you last missed a Wasps game. Also, you're a complete and utter biased idiot and I fail to believe you are at University, I hope you don't sit around me all season, because, well frankly, in the 90 minutes I've experienced of you, you're a complete and utter ****.

2) Esp, nice bald patch.

3) I was talking on my phone to my sister before the game (I have a Swedish accent) and someone disturbed me to ask if I was an agent? What the ****..

[Harrow Orn]

I think i've torn a muscle in my back due to shivering so much! Apparently a thermal topd and 4 layers on top of that isn't enough these days.

Roll on next Tuesday!

[J.B]

Doyley- 6.5 Usual Lloyd performance, he shows some good touches, one flick of note, and also the other side of Lloyd, such as a foul throw and running the ball out, instead of kicking it out when DG was down.




Are you serious? If so its a little harsh for you to criticise lloyd for choosing to run the ball out of play and taking one foul throw (which by the way seems to be a rule which some refs ignore and some take notice of).

For me Lloyd, Taylor and Heidar were our best players today. Hopefully Graham will perform against QPR next week (only played today to get him ready as he has to play due to HH's absence) with cleverley back in the side and we can take 3 points off that joke of club.

Great win today but we do look worryingly close to the relegation zone and we need to start winning our away matches. But then again being the Championship we will probably be out of the woods in a couple of weeks. Will be interesting to look at the table on Saturday though considering that we are not playing.

[leighton buzzard horn]

Sat with an ex pro tonight, so got some decent insight into our play. He said that Taylor was immense, (fairly obvious that one), but Bristol played right into our hands, said Graham was MOM for his hold up play and the fact that he found another yellow shirt with every ball, and that when we didn't have possesion our shape was superb.

.

Interesting point of view..may I ask who the ex-pro was?

[ImRonBurgundy?]

Interesting point of view..may I ask who the ex-pro was?
Will Hoskins?

[nascot]

In a nutshell, good first half, dull dull duller second half, Henderson is so lame he should be put down, it wasn't that cold, Brizzle City were lucky to finish with 11 on the pitch, Leicester let me down on my bet.

[Esp]

2) Esp, nice bald patch.
:rant:

Err, cheers.....love you too Svenska xXx

[krisvad]

said Graham was MOM for his hold up play and the fact that he found another yellow shirt with every ball
That's very interesting. That's something the average spectator won't see or at least don't rate.

Similar to the fact the the holding mid rarely gets any credit because of the nature of the role.


that when we didn't have possesion our shape was superb.That's good to hear. It's something that makes a difference in this league (and probably a Malky key point). Just a shame we seem to be sh!t in possession when playing away.



Sat with an ex pro tonight, so got some decent insight into our play.Let me join LBH in the "who was it" chant.

[krisvad]

(I have a Swedish accent)
My condolences mate. Some people just have it tough ;)

Funny as sh!t though someone asking if you were an agent. You should have said yes - a secret one so sshhhh :forehead:

[Defunct]

Interesting point of view..may I ask who the ex-pro was?


Let me join LBH in the "who was it" chant.

Never played for Watford, but I'd rather keep it to PM's.

[With A Smile]

Never played for Watford, but I'd rather keep it to PM's.

I took a former spurs reserve to QPR and he was very impressed with how we played and shaped when we didn't have the ball. He said that our set up stopped them playing and thought it was what made us sucsessful.

[Keano]

currently sitting in sunny 30+°C australia :cool:......but cursing winning results the moment i leave the country.

sounds like we are taking the initiative and scoring first and early in last two home wins.

[SM#16]

My condolences mate. Some people just have it tough ;)

Funny as sh!t though someone asking if you were an agent. You should have said yes - a secret one so sshhhh :forehead:

*******.

[8yellow4]

Good 1st half, thought the defence were solid throughout but 2d half the midfield particularly Eustace and Harley were absolutely awful. When the game was crying out for someone to steady it put there foot on the ball and calm everyone down Eustace just went missing - I don't think he played more than 2 5-10rd passes in the space of about 15 minutes. Harley kept getting sucked into the middle meaning that we had no outlet on the left to retain possession, allowing their right back to tuck in and help the midfield squeeze up on Lansbury whenever he got the ball and looked to move us forward. Harley being so narrow also meant that most of the attacks came down that side.

I would imagine that Bristol were what we were at Barnsley (minus the dirty b*s**** tactics), plenty of possession but toothless.

[dynamo380]

Good result and a decent enough performance in the first half. Thought we were poor tactically in the 2nd half . Our midfield got pushed back far to far and as an attacking threat they took our midfield out completely. Thought Grhaam had a decent game and the subsitution of Henderson for him was the wrong one. Imo going 4-5-1 would have been a much better option with the players we had on the bench. At the very least it would have stopped our midfield being pushed back into the defence.

I dont want to critise any off the players particualry, but Henderson is poor. Its not just that he's very very slow but his reactions are slow as well. I dont know how hes performed in the reserves but atm it looks like he's going to have a limited career as a championship footballer.

[wfc4ever]

I notice Bristol City brought on a couple of very quick players to try and get back into the game.

Maybe that is why we went with a slightly more negative defensive mind-set after the break rather than go for more goals and get caught out on the break.

It was the sort of performance we need to produce away from home really...get a goal or two then soak up the pressure which clearly we aren't doing on the road.

[Hornets32]

Good win helped by the formation of Bristol City in the first half, once they went to a 442 in the second half it was all them without having any real clear cut chances, only one header which produced another top class save from the best keeper outside the Premier League.

The first goal was due to an outstanding cross from Mariappa, you could not have wanted a better cross from the byline and it led to a very easy Heider header. The second goal was a very good finish from Taylor, side footed it in on the volley from a tight angle after a well flighted free kick. We were aided by some appalling fouls from Bristol, at least 2 could have gone and they were niggling and moaning all evening to the ref who was up their with Atwell in terms of performance, absolutely dire and giving all the niggly stuff and then bottling anything major.

MOTM by was Doyley, closely followed by Taylor (so great to have a commanding central defender again) absolutely brilliant tonight, 2 passes went astray but his defending was supurb and linked up really well with Harley. Eutace was very poor tonight I thought which led to Lansbury having to do a lot of his work, and was suprised to see him taken off for Jenkins (unless it was to rest his legs). Cowie was annomonous in the first half, picked up more in the second but his performances lately have also been bad. I think when Cleverly is fit, i would give Harley a run and drop Cowie.

Up front still worries me. I wonder if Heider and Graham actually get on as there does not seem to be much communication and they either seem to be very close together almost getting in each others way or too far apart. Don't get me wrong, Graham is playing well, there just seems to be something wrong. Don't know why Hoskins was not on bench (perhaps off on loan?) but we brought on Henderson again and all he did was run around with that weird chest out technique and loose the ball/fall over. Really puts in 100% but we needed someone to run the channels and use their pace up front in the last 20mins, he was not the answer.

Anyway, another win at home, this form should keep us up i reckon. Well done Malky and the lads
I think Hoskins was not even on the bench because at Barnsley I noticed he made a mistake and Malky had a go at him and Hoskins spread his arms wide and said something along the lines of "What do you want me to do about it" (may have been a few expletives)and I thought then bye bye Hoskins

[Wazza]

Helguson played really well last night! Highlight of his performance was in the closing seconds when he was in the corner and he went to lump the ball straight at one of the Bristol City players heads and it went straight back up the other end of the pitch to Eustace (i think)

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

2-0. Good win, even if it was an ugly performance at times. 3 points is what's crucial at this stage of the season. Our impressive home record goes on!

Good win.

you got home quick, bubbley.

hows life on the sarf coast?

we cruised it, brizzle ****y were as inept as sheff utd - the only problem was the numpty wfc fan base getting all boiled up becasue bcfc attacked us in the first 10 mins of 2nd half and kept the ball for long spells. We were in no danger but the wfc nupties were cacking their pampers as normal and getting all abusive and calling the players shyte and canut.

Good to see the programme with no mention of the russo canuts under the directors, chairman page. Oh how things are looking far more rosey now those canuts have ucked off and no longer disrupting the club and interfering with scouting missions to argentina paid for by the club and taking ridiculous percentage remuneration to turnover.

GS = premiership campaign, three semi finals, play offs.

Jimbob russo = hot water in the rookery and an application at court for administration signed with an x by he and the vino.:dismay:

[Jelboy]

Oh, sensational, my sides have split. What a load of tosh. Henderson was absolute, un-adulterated $hit when he came on. He did absolutely nothing. I remember one instance where a ball was hit forward. Graham would've chased it, but Henderson instead proceeded to canter after it not paying much attention and thus, a chance was wasted. There is NO WAY (imo) he should be ahead of Hoskins (and I don't like Hoskins) in the pecking order. Sorry Nak, but I totally disagree with you on this one.

That said, I'm pleased with the points. Sure, we huffed and puffed at times and rode our luck in places, but Bristol City are no mugs and they usually do pretty well against us. DG had a very good game today, he ran the channels well and did a lot of donkey-work, a good all round performance. In the first half we could've had a few more goals, we were very good and looked comfortable. I was expecting more of the same in the second half and I'm quite baffled as why we went so defensive in the second half. Our defence kept us in it at times, Taylor in particuarly looked fairly decent to me. That being the first time I've seen him since we signed him, he looks a good piece of business from MM. Loach impressed me in places, a bit hesitant on his line sometimes but dealt well with most things including one great stop from a header in the second half.

Finally, am I the only one who noticed what a bunch of cave-men Bristol City were? If they weren't lumping the ball up the pitch without much finesse/direction, they were kicking/sliding/biting/pulling/nudging lumps out of our players. They were VERY lucky to finish with 11 men if you ask me. The ref was far, far too weak and should've, perhaps could've sent off 1 or 2 of their players.

Totally agree about Henderson, looked out of touch, lacked copnfidence and did nothing in regard to holding up the ball, it just kept going back whence it came!

I can explain why we didn't kick on in the 2nd half - it was because I'd had a tenner on a 4-0 win @ 50/1. At half time I felt quietly confident... typical.

Johnson's son was a right gob, all game he was in the face of the referee - some of their assualts were awful, very poor team in my view, not a touch on what they were a few seasons ago.

[Spud]

Jesus man, substitute (no pun intended) Henderson for Cathcart for Hoskins for anyone else thats not in fashion this week and like the proverbial bog paper following the crap down the bog or in PYA's case, the leaf following in the woodland stream, you lot all follow suit.

Henderson is shyte, Hoskins isnt, all of a sudden. You couldnt make it up.

In my humble opinion and Ive said it all along, so no bandwagon jumping for me, Hoskins is a decent player, who could do well for us if he was given a run in the side.

But Malky has a problem with Hoskins (and no doubt somebody on here with 'connections' will put me right) and its not all Hoskins fault. At the end of the day the sign of a good manager is getting the best out of what you have and Malky has failed miserably there on that score (oooooh there we go agin). In fact I think Malky is a shyte manager full stop but thats another story. Playing one striker at home at the beginning of the season showed us what hes all about, theres better managers out there is all Ill say.

For me, Hoskins is a decent striker who will link up well with Lansbury and Cleverley, who for me are our best players by a country mile. All hoskins needs is a decent run in the side and not to be messed about. Remember Hoskin's wages arent his fault. The previous regime offered and agreed them. For that he cannot be criticised.

Danny Graham looks jaded and could do with a rest. Hes carried the striking responsibilities all season and its starting to show. Its like a load around his shoulders.

Its time to give Graham a rest and give Hoskins a run in the side. If he moves to another team in the Championship, it could be a move that will come back to bite us on the bum.

[With A Smile]

Jesus man, substitute (no pun intended) Henderson for Cathcart for Hoskins for anyone else thats not in fashion this week and like the proverbial bog paper following the crap down the bog or in PYA's case, the leaf following in the woodland stream, you lot all follow suit.

Henderson is shyte, Hoskins isnt, all of a sudden. You couldnt make it up.

In my humble opinion and Ive said it all along, so no bandwagon jumping for me, Hoskins is a decent player, who could do well for us if he was given a run in the side.

But Malky has a problem with Hoskins (and no doubt somebody on here with 'connections' will put me right) and its not all Hoskins fault. At the end of the day the sign of a good manager is getting the best out of what you have and Malky has failed miserably there on that score (oooooh there we go agin). In fact I think Malky is a shyte manager full stop but thats another story. Playing one striker at home at the beginning of the season showed us what hes all about, theres better managers out there is all Ill say.

For me, Hoskins is a decent striker who will link up well with Lansbury and Cleverley, who for me are our best players by a country mile. All hoskins needs is a decent run in the side and not to be messed about. Remember Hoskin's wages arent his fault. The previous regime offered and agreed them. For that he cannot be criticised.

Danny Graham looks jaded and could do with a rest. Hes carried the striking responsibilities all season and its starting to show. Its like a load around his shoulders.

Its time to give Graham a rest and give Hoskins a run in the side. If he moves to another team in the Championship, it could be a move that will come back to bite us on the bum.


Spud, Graham has ahd a rest for the last two, three or four games. He can't have much more.

Hoskins hada long run last year under Rodgers, who probably played the best possible football that he could have hoped for. I think Nak said that he started in about 13 of 15 games and then played 5 or 6 others as sub, with just one goal.

He may be a good player, but not at this level, I don't think Graham is either. Hoskins has been avaiable for two maybe three transfer windows now and no one has come in for him, not even a league 1 club.

If Boothroyd, Rodgers, Mackey, Jackett ( millwall ) all didn't rate him theer must be a reason. You make a very good point about him going to another championship club and biting us ont he bum.

How ? he might score against us but his not going to turn someones season. The club would let him go on a free but I don't see Plymouth, Peterborough, Ipswich, Reading, Scunny and all the others that need a goalscorer or someone who is going to provide goals, quueing up to either buy him or take him on loan.

He may not get on with Malky but the reason his not inthe side is because his not good enough, no other reason. If he was one of the other forementioned managers would have exploited his talent.

[biggles14]

Great result last night
Come on Watford!

[Spud]

Spud, Graham has ahd a rest for the last two, three or four games. He can't have much more.

Hoskins hada long run last year under Rodgers, who probably played the best possible football that he could have hoped for. I think Nak said that he started in about 13 of 15 games and then played 5 or 6 others as sub, with just one goal.

He may be a good player, but not at this level, I don't think Graham is either. Hoskins has been avaiable for two maybe three transfer windows now and no one has come in for him, not even a league 1 club.

If Boothroyd, Rodgers, Mackey, Jackett ( millwall ) all didn't rate him theer must be a reason. You make a very good point about him going to another championship club and biting us ont he bum.

How ? he might score against us but his not going to turn someones season. The club would let him go on a free but I don't see Plymouth, Peterborough, Ipswich, Reading, Scunny and all the others that need a goalscorer or someone who is going to provide goals, quueing up to either buy him or take him on loan.

He may not get on with Malky but the reason his not inthe side is because his not good enough, no other reason. If he was one of the other forementioned managers would have exploited his talent.

And Henderson and Sordell are better players ? Not for me ol son. And Id agree with you with Graham, I dont think hes good enough. A good squad player but not someone to rely on, game after game.

I think its more personal tween McKay and Hoskins, going back to Swansea away last year when Mckay was in charge and subbed Hoskins and Mckay wasnt too happy with Hoskins reaction. If it is cos of playing ability then why was Ellington given a run in the side ? He has easily been our worse player for years, an absolute donkey, who I might add was on alot more money than Hoskins as well.

I dont believe no ones been in for him. Boothroyd bought him and played him. Rodgers played him. Jackett at Millwall wanted him but we wouldnt let him go. Hoskins was well thought off at Forest but injury forced his loan period to end early.

I think its more personal, theres something wrong somewhere.

[With A Smile]

And Henderson and Sordell are better players ? Not for me ol son. And Id agree with you with Graham, I dont think hes good enough. A good squad player but not someone to rely on, game after game.

I think its more personal tween McKay and Hoskins, going back to Swansea away last year when Mckay was in charge and subbed Hoskins and Mckay wasnt too happy with Hoskins reaction. If it is cos of playing ability then why was Ellington given a run in the side ? He has easily been our worse player for years, an absolute donkey, who I might add was on alot more money than Hoskins as well.

I dont believe no ones been in for him. Boothroyd bought him and played him. Rodgers played him. Jackett at Millwall wanted him but we wouldnt let him go. Hoskins was well thought off at Forest but injury forced his loan period to end early.

I think its more personal, theres something wrong somewhere.

I do agree that he is ahead of both Henderson and Sordell, but both are young and learning but neither are a 3rd choice championshp striker.

If ever you meet with KJ he will happily tell you that he decided not to extend his load, he was available but it was KJ's choice not to. I agree he had a back injury at Forest, but last summer when he was made available they didn't come back in for him.

Sometimes players hit it off and it works for them, others have one wonderful season and then thats it, that was their moment and hey never ever erach those hights again, Ellington is a prime example.

Hoskins made 30 odd starts for Rotherham and scored about 16 or 17, he has made about 25 starts for us and scored just 5. Up and till he scored earlier this season he had never scored against anyone higher than us in the league !

At 23 he is no longer a player with potential or one for the future, he should be an established player. If he had the ability someone would have offered the money knowing that we would have sold him.

[olzy]

Malky doesnt like Hoskins its obvious. Last season is prime example, when Hoskins was on fire under Boothroyd, then Malky came in and dropped him.

There is no way Henderson is better than Hoskins. You would think if Malky gave him a run in the side he would score goals or contribute well to the side considering the style of play most of time and Hoskins link up play. It's not going to happen though he will keep playing out of form Graham and donkey Henderson.

[hornetgags]

Malky doesnt like Hoskins its obvious. Last season is prime example, when Hoskins was on fire under Boothroyd, then Malky came in and dropped him.

There is no way Henderson is better than Hoskins. You would think if Malky gave him a run in the side he would score goals or contribute well to the side considering the style of play most of time and Hoskins link up play. It's not going to happen though he will keep playing out of form Graham and donkey Henderson.

I must have missed that, I was probably queuing for a coffee.

[hornetgags]

Jesus man, substitute (no pun intended) Henderson for Cathcart for Hoskins for anyone else thats not in fashion this week and like the proverbial bog paper following the crap down the bog or in PYA's case, the leaf following in the woodland stream, you lot all follow suit.

Henderson is shyte, Hoskins isnt, all of a sudden. You couldnt make it up.

In my humble opinion and Ive said it all along, so no bandwagon jumping for me, Hoskins is a decent player, who could do well for us if he was given a run in the side.

But Malky has a problem with Hoskins (and no doubt somebody on here with 'connections' will put me right) and its not all Hoskins fault. At the end of the day the sign of a good manager is getting the best out of what you have and Malky has failed miserably there on that score (oooooh there we go agin). In fact I think Malky is a shyte manager full stop but thats another story. Playing one striker at home at the beginning of the season showed us what hes all about, theres better managers out there is all Ill say.

For me, Hoskins is a decent striker who will link up well with Lansbury and Cleverley, who for me are our best players by a country mile. All hoskins needs is a decent run in the side and not to be messed about. Remember Hoskin's wages arent his fault. The previous regime offered and agreed them. For that he cannot be criticised.

Danny Graham looks jaded and could do with a rest. Hes carried the striking responsibilities all season and its starting to show. Its like a load around his shoulders.

Its time to give Graham a rest and give Hoskins a run in the side. If he moves to another team in the Championship, it could be a move that will come back to bite us on the bum.

Is this opinion based on your extensive experience of football management and coaching?

[krisvad]

From BhaPPy (http://bhappy.wordpress.com/2010/02/10/watford-2-bristol-city-0-09022009/)


4- Liam Henderson. There’s something physically not quite right about him. It might be so obvious that I’ve missed it… maybe he’s got no neck or an extra shoulder or something, but he just looks… wrong. His appearance off the bench was clumsily ineffective; clearly short on pace, it’s difficult to see how he can make a sustained impact without everything else in his game coming together. His continued involvement speaks volumes about both our limited options and Will Hoskins’ low stock. And I’d better credit RW with input into this thunk or he’ll only go all mardy on me again…

[Aberystwyth_Hornet]

I must have missed that, I was probably queuing for a coffee.

To be fair to Hoskin's he had been doing well with Priskin before suddenly being dropped for the Swansea game by Malky. It wasn't even like Rasiak was fit, but we changed to 4-5-1 which i believe (though he denies it) to be Malky's favoured tactic. When he came back in to the side under Rodgers he was poor again

[hornetgags]

To be fair to Hoskin's he had been doing well with Priskin before suddenly being dropped for the Swansea game by Malky. It wasn't even like Rasiak was fit, but we changed to 4-5-1 which i believe (though he denies it) to be Malky's favoured tactic. When he came back in to the side under Rodgers he was poor again

Fair comment, but I think 'on fire' was a bit excessive.

[PotGuy]

Hoskins scored 17 goals in four months in League One!

Thats almost Beckford-esque, if not better.

There is no way that he could not have SOME impact in our team. We only have two (professional) strikers in the whole first team squad, and we went through a period of only having one!

Regardless of what anyone says at the very least he is good for 6 or 7 a season.

And by the by, the reason that nobody took him off our hands is because he is, according to many on here at least, on £7.5k/week! Nobody wants will match that wage when he hasn't made more than twenty on appearances for us in four years.

No reason exists as to why he shouldn't be playing SOME part in our team. We are paying him £7k to do absolutely nothing for four years.

[Spud]

Is this opinion based on your extensive experience of football management and coaching?

No its an opinion, something thats obviously not allowed in your little world.

[defreezer]

Hoskins scored 17 goals in four months in League One!

Thats almost Beckford-esque, if not better.



Its really not Beckford-esque. Beckford has banged them in consistently for a few seasons, Hoskins did it for 6 months. Scoring goals for half a season really doesnt make you a world beater, and from what I have seen of Hoskins he is nowhere near a world beater. I've never seen him excel and the firm belief that some of you on this message board have in his ability astounds me, at no time in all the years he has been here has he excelled. At one stage he did reasonably ok and scored a few goals, but even then I don't remember him looking that dangerous, he just looked like an average player who got lucky.

Other players who scored for 6 months but turned out to be shocking: Julian Joachim led the Premier League goalscorers for a while one season and turned out to be awful, Michael Rickets did well for half a year, even got capped by England and then turned utterly abysmal, Billy Sharp was **** when brought up from the lower leagues, the list does go on.

Plain and simple hes not up to it, and he has a bad attitude. I agree Henderson is awful, personally I would rather see Sordell and that new bloke Buckley on the bench as possible striking options. If hoskins has as bad an attitude as many say he does then Mackay shows weakness putting him on the bench so i'm pleased he doesnt do it.

[Esp]

No its an opinion, something thats obviously not allowed in your little world.
:sign15::sign15::sign15:

Totally agree - some people just don't GET football forums

They are a way of expressing your OPINIONS - whether others agree or disagree with your views doesn't make the point any less valid or worthy :forehead:

[Spud]

:sign15::sign15::sign15:

Totally agree - some people just don't GET football forums

They are a way of expressing your OPINIONS - whether others agree or disagree with your views doesn't make the point any less valid or worthy :forehead:


You're only agreeing with me cos valentines is drawing nearer and nearer...................:biggrin:

As far as Malky Mckay is concerned, in my humble opinion, playing one up front in the first game of the season, at home, showed how adventurous he is and how limited he is. Continually playing a numbskull like Ellingshyte showed him up. Cathcart was a big big big mistake and his mistakes cost us points. I came to the opinion very quickly that Mckay's only in the job cos he's the cheapest option.

[defreezer]

You're only agreeing with me cos valentines is drawing nearer and nearer...................:biggrin:

As far as Malky Mckay is concerned, in my humble opinion, playing one up front in the first game of the season, at home, showed how adventurous he is and how limited he is. Continually playing a numbskull like Ellingshyte showed him up. Cathcart was a big big big mistake and his mistakes cost us points. I came to the opinion very quickly that Mckay's only in the job cos he's the cheapest option.

I really don't understand that point of view when we are clearly over achieving from our start of season aims. Most people would have been happy with avoiding relegation this year, currently we are 11th and nearer the playoffs than relegation. He's done well. Maybe he made a mistake in his first game of the season playing one up top, but he obviously learnt that lesson as were not playing it anymore. I agree you did come to the opinion very quickly, but i think its an opinion you need to rethink with hindsight.

[UEA_Hornet]

Maybe he made a mistake in his first game of the season playing one up top, but he obviously learnt that lesson as were not playing it anymore.

We are. As recently as Barnsley.

[Layton]

and sheffield united last week !

[Spud]

I really don't understand that point of view when we are clearly over achieving from our start of season aims. Most people would have been happy with avoiding relegation this year, currently we are 11th and nearer the playoffs than relegation. He's done well. Maybe he made a mistake in his first game of the season playing one up top, but he obviously learnt that lesson as were not playing it anymore. I agree you did come to the opinion very quickly, but i think its an opinion you need to rethink with hindsight.

Yeah you're right we are over achieving but I still dont think Mckay is the right bloke for the job.

[defreezer]

Yeah you're right we are over achieving but I still dont think Mckay is the right bloke for the job.

I'm confused, you agree with me that were over achieving but dont think the manager is doing a good job then?

You criticised him playing Ellington off the bench, personally at the time I was happier seeing Ellington coming on than I was Hoskins. However rubbish Ellington was I at least felt he had the potential to change a game, he would always do one good thing when he came on. The problem was it was always generally followed by something ****. Hoskins I just see as a waste of time and space.

Cathcart was poor, but he was better than a reserve team player would have been. He filled a gap where one needed massive filling. Mackay has also made some superbly astute signings in the form of Lansbury and more Cleverly who is arguably one of the most talented players I have seen in a Watford shirt.

Yeah we play 451 occasionally, and I'm sure we will against QPR away as H is unavailable. I think playing 451 more comes down to the fact that we lack more than 2 good strikers. H and Graham. Graham has gone off the boil recently so we dropped him to the bench, a fair decision in my book.

I don't get the dislike of Mackay. He's got a team going through a huge transitional phase into a decent league position. Surely thats the bottom line.

[The Voice of Reason]

Hoskins scored 17 goals in four months in League One!

Thats almost Beckford-esque, if not better.

There is no way that he could not have SOME impact in our team. We only have two (professional) strikers in the whole first team squad, and we went through a period of only having one!

Regardless of what anyone says at the very least he is good for 6 or 7 a season.

And by the by, the reason that nobody took him off our hands is because he is, according to many on here at least, on £7.5k/week! Nobody wants will match that wage when he hasn't made more than twenty on appearances for us in four years.

No reason exists as to why he shouldn't be playing SOME part in our team. We are paying him £7k to do absolutely nothing for four years.

I'm not sure about this, but I believe Hoskins is on an appearance bonus and that is why he is not played as he would cost us even more money if he was to do so.

I am basing this on Eustace, who apparently agreed to waive his appearance fees to get more actual playing time. As Hoskins was signed around the same time he may have a similar clause in his contract, and maybe he is not willing to waive it, hence he does not play unless we really need him?

Please correct me if I am wrong, as I have only heard this from a non official source, so it may not be correct.

[Wazza]

4-5-1 for QPR this coming Tuesday seeing as Helguson cant play

[Spud]

I'm confused, you agree with me that were over achieving but dont think the manager is doing a good job then?

You criticised him playing Ellington off the bench, personally at the time I was happier seeing Ellington coming on than I was Hoskins. However rubbish Ellington was I at least felt he had the potential to change a game, he would always do one good thing when he came on. The problem was it was always generally followed by something ****. Hoskins I just see as a waste of time and space.

Cathcart was poor, but he was better than a reserve team player would have been. He filled a gap where one needed massive filling. Mackay has also made some superbly astute signings in the form of Lansbury and more Cleverly who is arguably one of the most talented players I have seen in a Watford shirt.

Yeah we play 451 occasionally, and I'm sure we will against QPR away as H is unavailable. I think playing 451 more comes down to the fact that we lack more than 2 good strikers. H and Graham. Graham has gone off the boil recently so we dropped him to the bench, a fair decision in my book.

I don't get the dislike of Mackay. He's got a team going through a huge transitional phase into a decent league position. Surely thats the bottom line.

You are confused mate, when the fark did Ellingshyte change a game ?

The point about Mckay or more importantly the manager's position, is that if the board had invested more money in getting a manager with more experience, one with proven succes at this level, we might be doing a whole lot better. Weve been a *** paper away from the relegation zone for a while now and all it will take is a couple of injuries or suspension and we're knackered. All the hard work will go down the bog. Playing one up front at home doesnt help. Playing a player with no ability or desire ala Ellingshyte didnt help.

Ive supported the team and Mckay to a certain extent and acknowledge the hard work we've achieved and punching above our weight, in previous posts but this time Ive been a bit more honest.

Thats all.

[defreezer]

You are confused mate, when the fark did Ellingshyte change a game ?

The point about Mckay or more importantly the manager's position, is that if the board had invested more money in getting a manager with more experience, one with proven succes at this level, we might be doing a whole lot better. Weve been a *** paper away from the relegation zone for a while now and all it will take is a couple of injuries or suspension and we're knackered. All the hard work will go down the bog. Playing one up front at home doesnt help. Playing a player with no ability or desire ala Ellingshyte didnt help.

Ive supported the team and Mckay to a certain extent and acknowledge the hard work we've achieved and punching above our weight, in previous posts but this time Ive been a bit more honest.

Thats all.

Nah i do agree with you on Ellington, you name him correctly a la Elingshyte. What i meant was i felt he had the potential to do something, whereas with Hoskins I just dont see anything.

I see what you mean about relegation but at the moment were nearer the playoffs so why be so glass half empty about it. By exactly the same method of thought we could keep the whole squad fit and with Taylor at the back and 2 wins in 3 sort of form make a push for a good top 10/push the playoffs finish.

On the 451 at home, I agree I dont like it particularly but with the lack of decent strikers at the club I understand it

[Spud]

Nah i do agree with you on Ellington, you name him correctly a la Elingshyte. What i meant was i felt he had the potential to do something, whereas with Hoskins I just dont see anything.

I see what you mean about relegation but at the moment were nearer the playoffs so why be so glass half empty about it. By exactly the same method of thought we could keep the whole squad fit and with Taylor at the back and 2 wins in 3 sort of form make a push for a good top 10/push the playoffs finish.

On the 451 at home, I agree I dont like it particularly but with the lack of decent strikers at the club I understand it

My whole point was Mckay. I dont like him purely cos he's the cheaper option, nothing personal simply that. Hes done well but I just think we could have done a whole lot better with a more proven and experienced manager.

Thats all.

[dynamo380]

As far as Malky Mckay is concerned, in my humble opinion, playing one up front in the first game of the season, at home, showed how adventurous he is and how limited he is.

I think your being unfair to McKay tbh. Its ok to claim he's being unadventurous or limitd, but you have to bear in mind how weak the squad is - especially at the start of the season. We have a patched up makeshift back four that gift poor goals away and untill Helguson arrived we only had one striker who was ever likely to score in Graham. Playing one up front was the right choice to make with the players we had/have and in all honesty its served us ok this season - we certainly didnt have either the players or a strong enough defence to go two up front.



Continually playing a numbskull like Ellingshyte showed him up.

But what was McKays alternatives before Helguson came back? Hoskins? Well he's flash but has so far failed to do anything of any signifcance or take any of the chances that all the previous managers gave him. Or theres Henderson, but he's not yet ready for the 1st team. Ellinglump was the best of a rather mediocore bunch unfortunately.



Most people would have been happy with avoiding relegation this year, currently we are 11th and nearer the playoffs than relegation. He's done well. Maybe he made a mistake in his first game of the season playing one up top, but he obviously learnt that lesson as were not playing it anymore.

We are still playing that formation, and the main ambition of this season is to avoid relegation, so to be where we are at this stage of the season is something we should all be happy with

[defreezer]

My whole point was Mckay. I dont like him purely cos he's the cheaper option, nothing personal simply that. Hes done well but I just think we could have done a whole lot better with a more proven and experienced manager.

Thats all.

Who else would you have taken at the time? Nobody decent was knocking about from memory. Also experience doesnt always equal better performance.

I find your argument about Malky extremely odd bearing in mind you agree we are over achieving at the moment. You almost seem to suggest another manager would do better, in which case how can you say Malky is over achieving?

[Spud]

Who else would you have taken at the time? Nobody decent was knocking about from memory. Also experience doesnt always equal better performance.

I find your argument about Malky extremely odd bearing in mind you agree we are over achieving at the moment. You almost seem to suggest another manager would do better, in which case how can you say Malky is over achieving?

This is like pulling teeth, without aneasthetic.

If we had invested a bit more in a more experienced manager, with a bit more 'pull', we might have achieved more, attracted better players, played better tactics, got more points on the board, got the best out of what we have, kept hold of players.

Our 'over' achieving this season is more luck than judgement, plus alot of hard work. Cos our squad is paper thin, wed be knackered with a couple of injuries to key players.

Thats all.

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

This is like pulling teeth, without aneasthetic.

If we had invested a bit more in a more experienced manager, with a bit more 'pull', we might have achieved more, attracted better players, played better tactics, got more points on the board, got the best out of what we have, kept hold of players.

Our 'over' achieving this season is more luck than judgement, plus alot of hard work. Cos our squad is paper thin, wed be knackered with a couple of injuries to key players.

Thats all.

puds ol mate, the russo barstewards sold our best 4 players so they could try to justify their extra ordinarily high remuneration to projected turnover and claim back leagl fees in getting the job in the first place and felt tere was enough spare around in the coffers to go to Argentina to chew beef, before putting the club into administration.

Malky has done a pretty good in my books under shyte conditions imposed by the absurd dictatorship of the salad *******s.

Seems to have picked up again since the russos ucked off and the th period of jimbob spitting his dummy out - AGAIN. Jeeeeesus they were a disease around our club.

The orns is goin up!:cool:

hows lil puds? has he done all the 57 varieties yet?

[Spud]

puds ol mate, the russo barstewards sold our best 4 players so they could try to justify their extra ordinarily high remuneration to projected turnover and claim back leagl fees in getting the job in the first place and felt tere was enough spare around in the coffers to go to Argentina to chew beef, before putting the club into administration.

Malky has done a pretty good in my books under shyte conditions imposed by the absurd dictatorship of the salad *******s.

Seems to have picked up again since the russos ucked off and the th period of jimbob spitting his dummy out - AGAIN. Jeeeeesus they were a disease around our club.

The orns is goin up!:cool:

hows lil puds? has he done all the 57 varieties yet?

Yo Pads how ya doin mate ?

You are right. Those eyetie scumbags sold us down the river and even had the temerity (Is that a word ? ) to appear on soccer am like they were popular. Lettuce munching ******s. I just dont like Malky. I think he was so far up the Russo's bums he needed a constant stream of Duracell batteries to keep him going cos with the size of their arses the charger wouldnt reach. A stronger more proven manager couldve/shouldve/wouldve done a better job methinks Pads, thats all.

Lil Spuds cool, hes done all 57 and is hungry for more !!!!!

:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

[nascot]

This is like pulling teeth, without aneasthetic.

If we had invested a bit more in a more experienced manager, with a bit more 'pull', we might have achieved more, attracted better players, played better tactics, got more points on the board, got the best out of what we have, kept hold of players.

Our 'over' achieving this season is more luck than judgement, plus alot of hard work. Cos our squad is paper thin, wed be knackered with a couple of injuries to key players.

Thats all.

Not easy to attract better players with no dosh though Spuddy. Agree with MM being the cheap option though.

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

Yo Pads how ya doin mate ?

You are right. Those eyetie scumbags sold us down the river and even had the temerity (Is that a word ? ) to appear on soccer am like they were popular. Lettuce munching ******s. I just dont like Malky. I think he was so far up the Russo's bums he needed a constant stream of Duracell batteries to keep him going cos with the size of their arses the charger wouldnt reach. A stronger more proven manager couldve/shouldve/wouldve done a better job methinks Pads, thats all.

Lil Spuds cool, hes done all 57 and is hungry for more !!!!!

:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

Interesting point, as i have never considered that - personally i reckon he was just happy at getting a chance to be manager - I bet you he is as glad as anyone that the salad m.unching canuting corn on the cob barstewards have ucked off. I bet he is delighted that Loachy wasn't sold and that Mr Fransen put in £500k to assist cash flow and player funding - seems no one was interested in doing or being business partners with the salad cobs, were they?

Give MM a chance or at least don't cuss him as he aint done too much wrong with what he has to work with, one of the best displays of football came under his reign away at Bristol City last season - Bear ( he he) in mind he has lost the quality of Tommy Smith and to a lesser degree the pace of the muff and has only just got in a decent sized centre back who is at least taller than Macnameeeeeeeeeeeeee.
When de heinz gonna invent da 58th variety for lil spud - to$$ers

[TheDon]

Why the Malky hate? Gotta love him, we're in the top half of the table, still have loach, not in admin (yet) and Doyley scored this season. What's not to like?

[Bobby Downes]

Why the Malky hate? Gotta love him, we're in the top half of the table, still have loach, not in admin (yet) and Doyley scored this season. What's not to like?

The pies?

[TheDon]

The pies?

Not Malky's fault. He's on my side with the pie disgrace
PIE MAKERS OUT NOW!

[8yellow4]

Baffled by the 451 criticism as it's probably the most common used system in football after 442.

The 2 def mids cover the defence while the other 3 break forward to support the lone striker. Used properly it's the most effective system there is.

[PotGuy]

Don't know how Malky can be criticised really.

He had quite literally all the quality players in the squad leave over the summer or last January when Brenda was doing his usual self-promoting chattering.

He was left with squad whose wage bill, though reduced by a third in just a few months, still needed further culling to take place and had no money to play with to bring talent in or stick on the wage bill.

We are sitting in the top half of the table, and on our day are capable of playing some fantastic football. It is no surprise we are struggling when most of our team are under 21, and he did very well in securing loan signings who have become the backbone of our squad.

He has spent virtually nothing. Derby, QPR, Brizzle, Ipshyte, Preston, Boro, Sheff Utd etc are all teams just a point or two either side of us having spent relatively massive amounts of money assembling their squads.

Get off his back. He has come in with his hands tied with no managerial experience and has us sitting in 11th. Not getting relegated was agreed by most as a good achievement at the beginning of the season, so where we are now is fantastic.

[SM#16]

Am I the only one who see's Spuds point?

He isn't saying Malky's necessarily doing an awful job with what he has, just that he'd rather have seen the club get someone a bit better in to get that little bit extra.

[defreezer]

This is like pulling teeth, without aneasthetic.

If we had invested a bit more in a more experienced manager, with a bit more 'pull', we might have achieved more, attracted better players, played better tactics, got more points on the board, got the best out of what we have, kept hold of players.

Our 'over' achieving this season is more luck than judgement, plus alot of hard work. Cos our squad is paper thin, wed be knackered with a couple of injuries to key players.

Thats all.

Mate sorry but i think your talking complete nonsense. We were within a few days of administration, where on earth would this further investment come from? How is our season more down to luck?

Mackay attracted one of the best players in the Championship to the Vic in Cleverly, there's absolutely no guarantee this mythical more experienced manager who you even refuse to name could have convinced Ferguson to loan Cleverly to us. Your argument has no substance, your just making a vague assertion we could do better with a more experienced manager. Theres every reason to think a different manager could have done a far worse job.

With all the players we lost in the summer regardless of what manager was in charge, I would have been happy with 11th at this stage. To say you wouldn't is just ridiculous

[Teide1]

6 out of eight wins and one draw in our last 8 home games, good enough for me!

[dynamo380]

Don't know how Malky can be criticised really.

He had quite literally all the quality players in the squad leave over the summer or last January when Brenda was doing his usual self-promoting chattering.

He was left with squad whose wage bill, though reduced by a third in just a few months, still needed further culling to take place and had no money to play with to bring talent in or stick on the wage bill.

We are sitting in the top half of the table, and on our day are capable of playing some fantastic football. It is no surprise we are struggling when most of our team are under 21, and he did very well in securing loan signings who have become the backbone of our squad.

He has spent virtually nothing. Derby, QPR, Brizzle, Ipshyte, Preston, Boro, Sheff Utd etc are all teams just a point or two either side of us having spent relatively massive amounts of money assembling their squads.

Get off his back. He has come in with his hands tied with no managerial experience and has us sitting in 11th. Not getting relegated was agreed by most as a good achievement at the beginning of the season, so where we are now is fantastic.

Completely agree with everything in your post. Not to mention that even if we could afford a more experienced/better manager - theres no guarentee that they would be doing a better job than McKay now anyway.

[The Voice of Reason]

Just read the letters in blue on my page........

He is doing great in my book :sign15::sign15::sign15:

[harry hornet]

Yo Pads how ya doin mate ?

You are right. Those eyetie scumbags sold us down the river and even had the temerity (Is that a word ? ) to appear on soccer am like they were popular. Lettuce munching ******s. I just dont like Malky. I think he was so far up the Russo's bums he needed a constant stream of Duracell batteries to keep him going cos with the size of their arses the charger wouldnt reach. A stronger more proven manager couldve/shouldve/wouldve done a better job methinks Pads, thats all.

Lil Spuds cool, hes done all 57 and is hungry for more !!!!!

:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

Your talking utter tosh, i dont think he was up the Russos bums he even voiced his views on the board room battle in the Watford observer before the Russos went. My view is there was no better man that knew the youth coming through the ranks than Malky, and with a club that has no money it made perfect sence to appoint him this season, my only fear is Malky will do brilliant this year and be lured away by a prem club, you dont know what youve got till its gone.

[hornetgags]

No its an opinion, something thats obviously not allowed in your little world.

My little world?

I asked a question, I didn't make a statement.

So as you're being antagonistic, I will also.

So Malky is shyte based on your extensive experience of football management and previous career as a professional footballer?

[hornetgags]

Am I the only one who see's Spuds point?

He isn't saying Malky's necessarily doing an awful job with what he has, just that he'd rather have seen the club get someone a bit better in to get that little bit extra.

Yeah I think you are the only one. Ironic huh?

Better how? I'm sure when you started your job you were glad when people weren't saying behind your back "He's still learning but we should have got someone better".

[SM#16]

Yeah I think you are the only one. Ironic huh?

Better how? I'm sure when you started your job you were glad when people weren't saying behind your back "He's still learning but we should have got someone better".

Hey, I'm not saying he's right, just that I understand what he's saying, most people intepreted it as Spud saying Malky is shyte.

[krisvad]

Hey, I'm not saying he's right, just that I understand what he's saying, most people intepreted it as Spud saying Malky is shyte.I too understand Spud's POV but I disagree compeletely.

I said at the beginning of the season that anything more than survival would be a fantastic achievement for us. I stll feel that way.

Looking at what Malky has done untill now I cannot see what anyone could have done better.

I can't see that anyone more experienced AND whom we could have attracted, could have brought in better players. I agree Dustcart was a disappointment but he came on the back of a player-of-the-season loan to Plymouth.

The rest of the players brought in by Malky (or the scouting staff) have been succesful. I know Graham has gone completely off the boil but his early form got us points and confidence - even made some people on here talk playoffs (silly to55ers).

We've thrown away many points over the course of the season but I put that down to our young squad rather than Malky's tactics. To me Malky is trying to keep us fairly positive - even when playing 4-5-1. I remember someone slating him for bringing on a forward for a defender or midfielder against Blackpool but at the same time people criticise when he tries to hole out for the points.

The reasons I feel Malky has done as well as we could have expected from ANYONE are:


With almost 2 thirds of the season gone we're closer to the playoffs than the relegation zone
Most times we're playing some good football
We've seen some great additions to our 1st team - both brought in and brought up from the reserves (Cleverly, Lansbury, Hodson and most recently Taylor)
We've managed to cut our wage costs by a big margin and still remained competitive
We are able to bring in talent for next season already (McGinn and Buckley)

To dislike someone for deploying a 4-5-1 at home in the first league match is silly imho - especially when since then it's yielded results and decent football as well.

To suggest someone else could have done better with the material we had is naïve. Even with SAF or Mourinho at the helm our financial constraints would have affected the options and I doubt we'd have been much better placed than we are now. Anyone we could have attracted and/or afforded couldn't have done better imho.

[Spud]

There is not one 'opinion' on this thread that has changed my opinion bout Malky. All the arguments have been based on has happened instead of what might have happened, if you get my drift.

[krisvad]

There is not one 'opinion' on this thread that has changed my opinion bout Malky. All the arguments have been based on has happened instead of what might have happened, if you get my drift.Firstly let me say I'm not trying to make you change your opinion. You're entitled to whatever opinion you have just as I'm entitled to disagree.

Secondly, basing arguments on what might have been is difficult. You have been asked by others precisely WHAT differences another manager could have made but you haven't explained the scenario.

So let's try again.


What manager of better pedigree and who - in your view - could have achieved more could we have attracted?
Given our financial situation, what could he have done differently on the player front?
When you say you think we could have done better - in what areas? Points, style of football etc?

[zztop]

Hey, I'm not saying he's right, just that I understand what he's saying, most people intepreted it as Spud saying Malky is shyte.

Erm, quote from Spud post on 10/2 at 1.06 pm "In fact I think Malky is a shyte manager full stop"

[Spud]

Erm, quote from Spud post on 10/2 at 1.06 pm "In fact I think Malky is a shyte manager full stop"

Yep I do.

[zztop]

Yep I do.

Who do you suggest would do better.

[Spud]

Who do you suggest would do better.

Steve Coppell

[zztop]

Steve Coppell

He said on tele (when he was a pundit around Christmas time) that he may start looking to come back to the game in the summer.

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

Am I the only one who see's Spuds point?

He isn't saying Malky's necessarily doing an awful job with what he has, just that he'd rather have seen the club get someone a bit better in to get that little bit extra.

who and at what cost? define better? there are no guarantees in football. Who's to say that GT would have done better. Who's to say that MM hasn't acually got that extra out of the players and we should by all accounts be sitting between pboro and plysmuff? Maybe wfc could have afforded a more expensive option if the fans were not so tight but willingly pay the extra money for the season ticket that was hugely reduced. The slashing of the season ticket money was to keep the fan base and ensure bums on seasts - however rightly or wrongly as we do not know how many people wouldn't have renewed - the fans strill expect the spend spend spend yet w.anked temselves of for 3 monmths over the reduction - the russo canuts mullered the club with high remuneration, legal fee refund and trip to argentina and 1% higher interest rate and god knows what else in perks ( vegas, milan??) on a secured loan than is now the case of current funders and you mongs want some one better, more experienced and not the cheap option.

Blame the russos canuts for the cheap option as they were the cheap barstewrads running the clubs finances into the ground to milk for themselves with no intention or real concern about wfc just their grubby green flied fingers on the deeds of the freehold at heart..

Where da uck they gone, have they been to a game to watch their beloved watford amongst their beloved and wonderful fans who they b.all rubbed and brainwashed to get into power?

Apart from that - do the russos cage their tomato's in greenhouses, cruel barsterwards if they do - let the red uns grow freely off the land and feel the universal breeze and wind and feel the raw sunlight. See how nasty those horrible beings are?

why do canuting canuts complain all the time, when we are top of the league the manager is shyte and they boo the team off after a loss and boo in play ioff semi's.

Fans Out Now! - scum!

[SM#16]

Oi! Read my next post after that

[Defunct]

How quickly we forget the utter dross served up during Boothroyds last year in charge. I like Malky, I like his signings, I like his style of play and I love the fact that he's doing it with no budget. Most of all, I like the blokes integrity.

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

How quickly we forget the utter dross served up during Boothroyds last year in charge. I like Malky, I like his signings, I like his style of play and I love the fact that he's doing it with no budget. Most of all, I like the blokes integrity.

how quickly we forget weeds 0 wfc 3, wfc 5 southampton 2, scum 1 wfc 2, wfc 3 popeye 0, a season in the premiership, a trip to villa park to play manure.

The problem is with fans if there are 3 bad results in a row they boo, whinge, moan and call for the sacking of the manager. The glass is arf empty ey, admin?;)

[zztop]

PYA, I think I agree with you, as somewhere amongst all that spouting, is commom sense, I think.

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

Oi! Read my next post after that

i did and its even more bollix than your first post - go back to reading beano and leave proper discussion for proper idiots, not wanabe idiots.;)

puds stated that malky is shyte.

[defreezer]

Steve Coppell

Ok so try coming up with someone who might realistically have actually joined. I think most people would agree Steve Coppell would be a superb manager to be at the helm. Aint gonna happen though is it.

[Defunct]

how quickly we forget weeds 0 wfc 3, wfc 5 southampton 2, scum 1 wfc 2, wfc 3 popeye 0, a season in the premiership, a trip to villa park to play manure.

The problem is with fans if there are 3 bad results in a row they boo, whinge, moan and call for the sacking of the manager. The glass is arf empty ey, admin?;)

I said the last year Bear, Betty's first 2 years were superb and he will always be a legend for that promotion season. Unfortunately I think he began to believe his own bollix.

[Spud]

Ok so try coming up with someone who might realistically have actually joined. I think most people would agree Steve Coppell would be a superb manager to be at the helm. Aint gonna happen though is it.

Ok and why didnt we get Coppell ? Cos we couldnt afford him like so many others and we got Malky cos he was cheap. And thats my argument. With a bit more investment in the manager we could have achieved alot more. My argument is nothing personal against Malky, he might be a good bloke but I dont rate him as a manager, thats all. Hes done well, no denying that but I think a more experienced and proven manager could have or would have done better and maybe stood up to the lettuce *******s and kept hold of at least Smith. They wouldve or couldve got the best out of the players, they even might have got a little bit more respect from Ellington who clearly thought we were not worthy of his consirderable talent.

Thats all.

[SM#16]

i did and its even more bollix than your first post - go back to reading beano and leave proper discussion for proper idiots, not wanabe idiots.;)

puds stated that malky is shyte.

Didn't even realise they still made the Beano if I'm honest.

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

Didn't even realise they still made the Beano if I'm honest.

Perhaps it has beeno ( see what i did there?) taken out of our lives due to a possible disrespect to beans - would you like to be referred to as a beano if you were a bean? jeeeesus could be deemed a relation to a russo, ouch , do i not like that. Political correctness is a good thing, init?

u ornssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

Ok and why didnt we get Coppell ? Cos we couldnt afford him like so many others and we got Malky cos he was cheap. And thats my argument. With a bit more investment in the manager we could have achieved alot more. My argument is nothing personal against Malky, he might be a good bloke but I dont rate him as a manager, thats all. Hes done well, no denying that but I think a more experienced and proven manager could have or would have done better and maybe stood up to the lettuce *******s and kept hold of at least Smith. They wouldve or couldve got the best out of the players, they even might have got a little bit more respect from Ellington who clearly thought we were not worthy of his consirderable talent.

Thats all.

aidy was cheap and got us to the premiershyte in his first fool season as manager - blame the russos not malky - they appointed him! GT did say at the time about the appointment that if it went wrong the board would have to answer to the appointment and take responsibility. Maybe all was not what it seems in the boardroom from day one?

blame da russos!

[Wazza]

Malky is doing a good job!

Yes he was cheap, so what? Are we struggling at the bottom of the table? No

We are skint, we cant afford to get top class championship players in so he is doing a good job with what he already has. Obviously the addition of Lansbury and Cleverley have helped us a lot this season.

Stop being so fickle everyone! Lets get behind the manager and the team!

There is a reason why he is picking the team and why some of you are sitting behind your computer screens...

[Spud]

aidy was cheap and got us to the premiershyte in his first fool season as manager - blame the russos not malky - they appointed him! GT did say at the time about the appointment that if it went wrong the board would have to answer to the appointment and take responsibility. Maybe all was not what it seems in the boardroom from day one?

blame da russos!

Still not convinced and I still dont like him. But I do agree with you, to some extent, Mr Bear on the Russo front.

Any road as for the bean ting, I like em, be dem broad, baked or kidney. and I always have a little olive oil in me baked beansa as they are cooking. They are mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...........

[SM#16]

Kidney Beans > all.

[Spud]

Kidney beans, chilled with onion, olive oil and salt, with a little garlic bread......mmmmmmmmm

Wheres Moog these days any road ?

[defreezer]

Still not convinced and I still dont like him. But I do agree with you, to some extent, Mr Bear on the Russo front.

Any road as for the bean ting, I like em, be dem broad, baked or kidney. and I always have a little olive oil in me baked beansa as they are cooking. They are mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...........

I agree with Paddington as well on that.

The reason we would never have got Coppell wasnt money though, he wouldnt come to Watford. Why on earth would he. What a step backwards for him. We are not a big enough club to get managers of his pedigree and we were financially crippled at the time of appointing malky. Why would coppel want to come to a club looking like it was about to sell all its best players (which we did) and face a relegation battle (which we should be but fortunately Malky has done bloody well to keep us away from that thus far.)

[Spud]

I agree with Paddington as well on that.

The reason we would never have got Coppell wasnt money though, he wouldnt come to Watford. Why on earth would he. What a step backwards for him. We are not a big enough club to get managers of his pedigree and we were financially crippled at the time of appointing malky. Why would coppel want to come to a club looking like it was about to sell all its best players (which we did) and face a relegation battle (which we should be but fortunately Malky has done bloody well to keep us away from that thus far.)


Beans is where its at now man. How do you like yours ?

[krisvad]

Beans is where its at now man. How do you like yours ?Got to be refried...

You're still dodging questions from earlier Spud. Now you've resorted to changing the subject - are you female by any chance?

If you don't like Malky start a MON campaign - it worked for Paddy re. the Russos (though he doesn't seem to have noticed as he keeps doing it)

S&P.O.N

;)

[Spud]

Got to be refried...

You're still dodging questions from earlier Spud. Now you've resorted to changing the subject - are you female by any chance?

If you don't like Malky start a MON campaign - it worked for Paddy re. the Russos (though he doesn't seem to have noticed as he keeps doing it)

S&P.O.N

;)

Jesusmarynjoseph. Sticking pins in me eyes is starting to appeal to me.

Pads is spot on the russo's scum appointed Malky with one eye on gaining from it. Malky is the cheaper option. He has done ok this season but a more proven and experienced manager could have done better by keeping players and gaining respect from others, better tactics and maybe better cooked beans in the club canteen.

And as for Steve Coppell opting for bigger clubs, wasnt he manager of those giants of football, Reading ? Real Madrid were quaking in their boots at that appointment.

[krisvad]

Jesusmarynjoseph. Sticking pins in me eyes is starting to appeal to me.

Pads is spot on the russo's scum appointed Malky with one eye on gaining from it. Malky is the cheaper option. He has done ok this season but a more proven and experienced manager could have done better by keeping players and gaining respect from others, better tactics and maybe better cooked beans in the club canteen.

And as for Steve Coppell opting for bigger clubs, wasnt he manager of those giants of football, Reading ? Real Madrid were quaking in their boots at that appointment.
You're still not answering but leave it. I don't want you to

My point is - cheap or expensive, Malky has done as well as anyone we could attract. And while Reading or Saints aren't real Madrid they're still clubs with better long-term perspective than us - I can't see someone like Coppell or Curbs joining us.

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

Jesusmarynjoseph. Sticking pins in me eyes is starting to appeal to me.

Pads is spot on the russo's scum appointed Malky with one eye on gaining from it. Malky is the cheaper option. He has done ok this season but a more proven and experienced manager could have done better by keeping players and gaining respect from others, better tactics and maybe better cooked beans in the club canteen.

And as for Steve Coppell opting for bigger clubs, wasnt he manager of those giants of football, Reading ? Real Madrid were quaking in their boots at that appointment.


for me this where some of da issue lay, puds ol mate and lover of beans and olive oil. It was da russos who sold da players not malky - would malky have wanted to sell noddy, willo 2, muff and tam - i am not sure - maybe a question to be asked directly to him at the fans forum. As to a different, betetr more experienced and higher paid manager being able to have kept them - my point is that thr russos scum canuts had the say in these matters and didn't give a flying corn on the cob about the playing side -as long as the club had enough funds to pay their high remuneration and interest and they could cream as much as they could - which they did.

Krisvad - why don't you tell the simpson, ashton, boothbroyd bashers that they haven't noticed that they have gone well over a year ago - whats right forone aint wrog for another when they stop, i stop!

[dynamo380]

The reason we would never have got Coppell wasnt money though, he wouldnt come to Watford.

Exactley. Even if Coppell hadnt seen us as a step backwards he still wouldnt have come here because he stated very publicly that at the end of the season he was taking a break from football.

[krisvad]

Krisvad - why don't you tell the simpson, ashton, boothbroyd bashers that they haven't noticed that they have gone well over a year ago - whats right forone aint wrog for another when they stop, i stop!you know what - good point. And the Russos aren't gone yet are they - still own about a 3rd of the club. Keep it up Paddy - I'm sure we can get rid of them all together. Them and Simpson - and maybe we can move forward and lay the past to rest.

[afanof]

Ok and why didnt we get Coppell ? Cos we couldnt afford him like so many others and we got Malky cos he was cheap. And thats my argument. With a bit more investment in the manager we could have achieved alot more. Investment in the manager is no guarantee of success - remember Vialli, remember Aidy?


My argument is nothing personal against Malky, he might be a good bloke but I dont rate him as a manager, thats all. It is personal against Malky. He has exceeded expectations so far. You seem to be using hindsight to reason that if Malky has got us so far, a more expensive manager would have got us further. It doesn't work like that, plus we don't have the money for a more expensive manager.


Hes done well, no denying that but I think a more experienced and proven manager could have or would have done better and maybe stood up to the lettuce *******s and kept hold of at least Smith. The selling of the crown jewels was down to the Russos and out of Malky's control. He would have wanted to keep Smith. What he has achieved without our best players is remarkable and deserves credit and respect.

They wouldve or couldve got the best out of the players, they even might have got a little bit more respect from Ellington who clearly thought we were not worthy of his consirderable talent. Before Malky, Brendan and before him Aidy (and before him Tony Mowbray), none of these managers was able to get a performance out of Ellington.
Thats all.

Malky is doing everything that was asked of him and more. He doesn't deserve to be called shyte.

[wfc4ever]

TBH I don't recall too many great rumours of top experienced rushing to apply for the job last summer but I might be wrong?

Malky got the job because he knew and accepted what the club would give a new manager to work with.

Not sure how many managers with great ambtions would have done that really?

Lets be honest..Rodgers wanted to walk within a week of really knowing how skint we were...

[dynamo380]

my point is that thr russos scum canuts had the say in these matters and didn't give a flying corn on the cob about the playing side -as long as the club had enough funds to pay their high remuneration and interest and they could cream as much as they could - which they did.

Im not going to defend Russo because quite frankly he doesnt deserve it, but whoever had been chairman when other clubs where trying to buy Smith, Willo etc would still have sold those players because the club needed the money - im sure as hell certain that Simpson would have sold them and more than likely for less than we actually did get for them.



Krisvad - why don't you tell the simpson, ashton, boothbroyd bashers that they haven't noticed that they have gone well over a year ago - whats right forone aint wrog for another when they stop, i stop!


Tbh Russo, Simpson,ashton and to a lesser extent hoofers all deserve to be bashed for their rather large and needless part in mismanaging this club and squandering all the money/financial security

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

Im not going to defend Russo because quite frankly he doesnt deserve it, but whoever had been chairman when other clubs where trying to buy Smith, Willo etc would still have sold those players because the club needed the money - im sure as hell certain that Simpson would have sold them and more than likely for less than we actually did get for them.

Tbh Russo, Simpson,ashton and to a lesser extent hoofers all deserve to be bashed for their rather large and needless part in mismanaging this club and squandering all the money/financial security

but the fans won't accept a £50 million windfall without spending on players and paying the wages to compete in the premiership. to back that up, look at the debates about needing to bring in players just to build a stronger squad this season to avoid relegation, its no different, if we can't afford them, then we shouldn't bring them in. We could afford them in the premiershyte and with the parachute monies but didn't gain promotion back -came closeish by getting to the play offs but not enough - a failure or a sign of ongoing ambition which has a price?

Is a football club forever financially secure? Name me one, please - that is a thought of illusion and grandeur. Manure one of, if not the biggest club in the world - huge debt - luckily for them they have a brand name world wide. Where would chelsea be and arsenal paying back the cost of their stadium, liverpool with their yankee doodle dandies, wet spam, naffwich, saints etc etc etc etc all financially stretched.

You say mismanaged and really the implication of blame you are putting in the shoes of GS and cashton, throwing in the russos name who already had everyone hating gs and ashton for the very mismanagement you speak about - actually if you step back from the one club scenario and the emotion of being a wfc fan and look at football as a whole and the finances surrounding it - i wonder where wfc stand in the league of debt compared to the footballing success/highs we have had in the last 7 years.?

Our debt to success ratio? ( what are the costs entailed in getting to and attempting to stay in the premiershyte)
Our debt compared to other clubs debts?

At the end of the day, we have paid everyone to date, will be according to JW by 1/7/2010 in our own manageable hands, with costs in line with what we can afford and lets say at worse £2m light on ongoing cash flow. We still own the freehold - valuable asset or per jimbob " very valuable asset" ( have you torn up the charge over it?). Have a few promising players coming through the ranks, Loachy a potential £2m+ if needs were to sell, a well respected and publicised academy and freehold pub waiting to be turned into the Watford Poker centre of excellence and hot water in the rookery..

Uck me - well done gs, cashton, jimbob for managing the club pretty well - even though a bit too much cream was milked by various parties.

I for one enjoyed the successes of gs/ab - it was exciting. Jimbob gave us no success and we could have been lumbered with that twot from gillingham as manager when jimbob publicly wrote he would have him as manager.

Life is uckin wonderful. :cool:

[20/20 Vision]

Admin and Afanof have got it right. "More experienced" doesn't mean "better". Have you forgotten that Coppell walked put on Manchester City in days and left Reading of his own accord because he was burnt out? He's obviously a bit fragile and there's no guarantee he would have been a success at Watford, even if he had agreed to come.

Famous, old-school managers - even GT - are finding it difficult nowadays, when the agents have so much power and the players so much money. A young manager in tune with the modern world might be more able to get the best out of his players - provided it's the right young manager.

I've been impressed with what Malky has done on the field this season, and even more impressed with how he has handled the media.

[Layton]

I cant complain , we are mid table , which is where with the players we have , we should , be , cant really ask for more at the minute...

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

I cant complain , we are mid table , which is where with the players we have , we should , be , cant really ask for more at the minute...

can we ask for more in an hour? Please sir!

[Layton]

wot r u loike paddnygton you numpty

[PaddingtonsYellowArmy]

wot r u loike paddnygton you numpty

i is like a numpty, init!:cool:

[Layton]

Blud !!!!!!!!!